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Forums - Music techology
Subject: Is LOGIC AUDIO really that good ?
Original Message Date: 08-Sep-98 @ 04:42 AM - Is LOGIC AUDIO really that good ?
The vibe I'm getting from some sources is that
Logic is really pro stuff, blows away Cake and maybe even VST, but has anyone been using it and
whats the opinion on it ?
Logic is really pro stuff, blows away Cake and maybe even VST, but has anyone been using it and
whats the opinion on it ?
Message 11/33 02-Oct-98 @ 01:48 AM - RE: Is LOGIC AUDIO really that good ?
how much is micrologic in the u.k.? i am sick to the fuck, fuck, fuckety teeth of waiting for a goddamn pc sequencer for my hardware based studio... oh yes, you germans are all very nice. you can operate a speak 'n spell, but you can't bloody put anything in the post can you?
oh yes, and furthermore.. of the six new components i've bought in the last year, three have been lemons. does this seem extraordinary to anyone else?
nordless, sequencerless, joyless
xoxos.
oh yes, and furthermore.. of the six new components i've bought in the last year, three have been lemons. does this seem extraordinary to anyone else?
nordless, sequencerless, joyless
xoxos.
Message 12/33 02-Oct-98 @ 09:52 AM - RE: Is LOGIC AUDIO really that good ?
What six components have you bought (or tried)? I've only bought 1 thing this year but I sold it on almost straight away (an1x).. that's not what you mean though is it?
Message 13/33 02-Oct-98 @ 03:21 PM - RE: Is LOGIC AUDIO really that good ?
no, i mean i've bought six brand new pieces of hardware, three of which have turned out to be duds and i've had to return.
this just pisses me off (especially because my time without a decent synth begins this morning..) and i was hoping someone would say something like 'oh, i've bought lots of stuff that worked just lovely' to give me hope for a future where it's possible to come home from the shop and not go back for a bit. i bloody paid for a keyboard that hasn't been around the world in eighty days or more..
then again, i'm just lucky. i was the one who won free groceries two consecutive weeks (not to mention free balloons!) and there's that funny van always parked across the street and those little voi... who the hell are you anyway!! how'd my weekly world news get all wet? goddamn fishnets run again! i pull out more and more copper spaghetti...
aaaarrghhh!
xoxos.
this just pisses me off (especially because my time without a decent synth begins this morning..) and i was hoping someone would say something like 'oh, i've bought lots of stuff that worked just lovely' to give me hope for a future where it's possible to come home from the shop and not go back for a bit. i bloody paid for a keyboard that hasn't been around the world in eighty days or more..
then again, i'm just lucky. i was the one who won free groceries two consecutive weeks (not to mention free balloons!) and there's that funny van always parked across the street and those little voi... who the hell are you anyway!! how'd my weekly world news get all wet? goddamn fishnets run again! i pull out more and more copper spaghetti...
aaaarrghhh!
xoxos.
Message 14/33 02-Oct-98 @ 04:16 PM - RE: Is LOGIC AUDIO really that good ?
Hmmm, I tend to spend everyday without a decent synth.. so maybe that makes you feel better? All I have is the cz-101 and a knackered bass station.. crappy awe64 samples.. fuck the only thing I've got thats not shite is the drumstation..
Ok... I bought my drumstation / mixer / fx unit / sampler.... All these things arrived in perfect working order and are still working today...
There you go.
Ok... I bought my drumstation / mixer / fx unit / sampler.... All these things arrived in perfect working order and are still working today...
There you go.
Message 15/33 02-Oct-98 @ 07:46 PM - RE: Is LOGIC AUDIO really that good ?
well who the hell is going to pity some prat with a bunch of disco gear...
yep. well, i spent a decade during which i moved UP to a mirage 8 bit monophonic 64k sampler and cassette 4 track...
BUT I'M STILL PISSED!!!!!!
yep. well, i spent a decade during which i moved UP to a mirage 8 bit monophonic 64k sampler and cassette 4 track...
BUT I'M STILL PISSED!!!!!!
Message 16/33 02-Oct-98 @ 09:36 PM - RE: Is LOGIC AUDIO really that good ?
Logic Audio is okay for audio, but it's strength lies in it's midi sequencing capabilities, and in that field it excels. I figure use the right tools for the right job. As far as .wav's go, I'd say edit the waves on your computer, if you feel the urge, and dump them elsewhere, but there's no beating a good outboard sampler for playback sound quality, and realtime tweeking (if you're into that sort of thing). I'd say skip Logic Audio, and just go with a full version of Logic. Use it to sequence your outboard gear, then record the audio onto you free demo version of ProTools, and burn your next CD on the cheap. Works for my partner!
Ape
Ape
Message 17/33 03-Oct-98 @ 07:50 PM - RE: Is LOGIC AUDIO really that good ?
well... join the club as far as hardware is concerned... everything seems to be well fucked up right now.... maybe it's the shift in manufacturing base that all the majors have done... or maybe it's simply the stress showing in workers as their economy collapses.....
As for Logic.... ....first impressions... !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!... (Victor Meldrew review !!!......)
i have just spent 4 hours using Logic audio platinum... and like all S/W.. i like to see how easy & intuitive it is without looking at the manual....... result... nothing.,,,, nada.... zilch.... fuck-all..... zero....
THE WORST DESIGNED, ugliest, least logical, nonsensical, overly complicated, useless, CRAPPIEST S/WARE I EVER USED IN MY ENTIRE LIFE,...grrrrrrrrrrr !!!!...
LOGIC ????.... WHAT A FUCKING JOKE... IT IS THE SINGULAR LEAST LOGICAL S/W I EVER ENCOUNTERED !!...
TO ME, IT COMES OVER LIKE SOME ABSOLUTELY TERRIBLE AMATUER S/W SOMEONE WROTE AND IS TRYING TO DISTRIBUTE ON THE INTERNET....
I'LL GO FURTHER.... IT IS LIKE 5 ACCOUNTANTS GOT TOGETHER , WHO ALL WORK WITH SPREADSHEETS AND ACCOUNTS S/W, BUT WHO ALL PLAY PIANO AS A HOBBY, AND DECIDED TO WRITE A S/W, AND EMPLOYED A BLIND MAN WITH THE IQ OF A DEMENTED YAK TO DESIGN THE GUI... .. IT'S ABOUT AS MUSICIAN FRINDLY AS...ER....WELL, I SIMPLY CANT THINK OF ANYTHING AS A WITTY PARALLEL....
as much use as a wickerwork seat in a nudist colony.... as useful as a pork chop at a barmitzvah.... christ-on-a-bike.... you need a fucking degree in rocket science...
honestly...... this makes Quark express look like MS paintbox !!.....
c'mon seriously.... it's not like i'm inexperienced... 4 fucking hours... and i cant even get a single itty-bit of audio to play... and frankly, i cant for the life of me tell if it should be playing or not !!!... it is TOTALY ... ILLOGICAL.... that is my opinion... as a newbie, i wouldnt touch it with a bargepole....
LOOK.... SOME THINGS SHOULD JUST BE THERE... OBVIOUS... EASY TO SEE, SIMPLE TO GET TO... THIS IS LIKE OFFERING SOMEONE A NEW CAR TO TEST DRIVE, AND AFTER 4 HOURS, YOU TELL THEM THE KEY TO THE IGNITION IS INSIDE THE FUCKING REAR WHEEL-ARCH....
thankyou..... and goodnight...
new version, .....after 1 hour of Mr Avene tutoring me from Ozland via ICQ !!!!.....
well, it's got some very good features, even at the basic OZ-tutored level I'm currently at so far.......
best one... it hasn't bloody crashed so far !!! (VST??).. and it hasn't lost the soundcard either !!!.... and i didnt have to twat around with asio panels and pre-roll, and buffers, and swinging dead cats round me head at midnight in a deserted graveyard whilsty dancing on a pile of tortilla's in an attempt to get the midi timing to sound less like a drunk banjo player trying to hold down a solid 4/4 riff at an annual pub piss-up........YES... EVEN WITH MY BELOVED TAHITI CARD !!!... (apparently it's common knowledge now that VST doesnt like TB cards much (!!???)...well that's what i keep getting told....
the note inputting in the drum section is excellent, you draw the drum velocities, as you draw the notes.... very tasty... and all that.... so the drums are in rows working down, and across from left to right... but each beat you input looks like the volume level in cubase... so you see how you can input a note and velocity simultaeneously.... i can see why it is apparently popular with DRum & Bass people.....
only other things i've done is.... REGIONS !!!!!.... YES... AS SIMPLE AS IN SAW PLUS !!!!... iand that has me real excited, cos it;'s as near as dammit like having sawplus attatched..... go to the audio files in the little file box.... click on one.... edit appears... drag a section... create a region... name it... there it is in the box... add it into the track where you like... excellent.... i found this a tad easier than VST's rather cryptic Pool, which always baffles me a bit....
the mixer is lush... and the FX are PLENTIFUL... and very good..... the reverb is nice.... and the fx are easy on the eye, and easy to manipulate the settings.... simple sliders.... but all in a tasty easy to look at colour scheme..... toos of eq types included.....
well.......i'm starting to get happy.... and i have a horrible feeling, that i'm gonna fall in love with Logic..... oh GOD !!....
BUT.... my comments at first still stand.... it is so illogical... i honestly would not have stood a chance without some simple tuition..... manuals are very hard to wade thru to glean out the info you need to get going...
If i was working at logic... i'd seriously think about re-jigging a few of the icons... wel... ALL OF THEM FRANKLY......... and the layout needs a little work too.... after all.... i'm only a dumb musician.......
bloody excellent proggie so far..... and hey... it still hasn't crashed !!!..... so i wanna see what i can get out of it, on an old 200MMX..... if i can get some, i'd rather learn it, than have to upgrade stuff and fuck about to get VST to work..... I LOVE my tahiti card.... so this proggie seems to allow it to work....
anyhows... i'm off for an indian ..... i'm gonna leave it running while I'm gone... and see if it is still running when i get back in a few hours... a task i should say VST has never accomplished... i lways come home to a frozen screen... (TB card dontcha know !!)... adios.... WELL worth a good demo at a good store....
As for Logic.... ....first impressions... !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!... (Victor Meldrew review !!!......)
i have just spent 4 hours using Logic audio platinum... and like all S/W.. i like to see how easy & intuitive it is without looking at the manual....... result... nothing.,,,, nada.... zilch.... fuck-all..... zero....
THE WORST DESIGNED, ugliest, least logical, nonsensical, overly complicated, useless, CRAPPIEST S/WARE I EVER USED IN MY ENTIRE LIFE,...grrrrrrrrrrr !!!!...
LOGIC ????.... WHAT A FUCKING JOKE... IT IS THE SINGULAR LEAST LOGICAL S/W I EVER ENCOUNTERED !!...
TO ME, IT COMES OVER LIKE SOME ABSOLUTELY TERRIBLE AMATUER S/W SOMEONE WROTE AND IS TRYING TO DISTRIBUTE ON THE INTERNET....
I'LL GO FURTHER.... IT IS LIKE 5 ACCOUNTANTS GOT TOGETHER , WHO ALL WORK WITH SPREADSHEETS AND ACCOUNTS S/W, BUT WHO ALL PLAY PIANO AS A HOBBY, AND DECIDED TO WRITE A S/W, AND EMPLOYED A BLIND MAN WITH THE IQ OF A DEMENTED YAK TO DESIGN THE GUI... .. IT'S ABOUT AS MUSICIAN FRINDLY AS...ER....WELL, I SIMPLY CANT THINK OF ANYTHING AS A WITTY PARALLEL....
as much use as a wickerwork seat in a nudist colony.... as useful as a pork chop at a barmitzvah.... christ-on-a-bike.... you need a fucking degree in rocket science...
honestly...... this makes Quark express look like MS paintbox !!.....
c'mon seriously.... it's not like i'm inexperienced... 4 fucking hours... and i cant even get a single itty-bit of audio to play... and frankly, i cant for the life of me tell if it should be playing or not !!!... it is TOTALY ... ILLOGICAL.... that is my opinion... as a newbie, i wouldnt touch it with a bargepole....
LOOK.... SOME THINGS SHOULD JUST BE THERE... OBVIOUS... EASY TO SEE, SIMPLE TO GET TO... THIS IS LIKE OFFERING SOMEONE A NEW CAR TO TEST DRIVE, AND AFTER 4 HOURS, YOU TELL THEM THE KEY TO THE IGNITION IS INSIDE THE FUCKING REAR WHEEL-ARCH....
thankyou..... and goodnight...
new version, .....after 1 hour of Mr Avene tutoring me from Ozland via ICQ !!!!.....
well, it's got some very good features, even at the basic OZ-tutored level I'm currently at so far.......
best one... it hasn't bloody crashed so far !!! (VST??).. and it hasn't lost the soundcard either !!!.... and i didnt have to twat around with asio panels and pre-roll, and buffers, and swinging dead cats round me head at midnight in a deserted graveyard whilsty dancing on a pile of tortilla's in an attempt to get the midi timing to sound less like a drunk banjo player trying to hold down a solid 4/4 riff at an annual pub piss-up........YES... EVEN WITH MY BELOVED TAHITI CARD !!!... (apparently it's common knowledge now that VST doesnt like TB cards much (!!???)...well that's what i keep getting told....
the note inputting in the drum section is excellent, you draw the drum velocities, as you draw the notes.... very tasty... and all that.... so the drums are in rows working down, and across from left to right... but each beat you input looks like the volume level in cubase... so you see how you can input a note and velocity simultaeneously.... i can see why it is apparently popular with DRum & Bass people.....
only other things i've done is.... REGIONS !!!!!.... YES... AS SIMPLE AS IN SAW PLUS !!!!... iand that has me real excited, cos it;'s as near as dammit like having sawplus attatched..... go to the audio files in the little file box.... click on one.... edit appears... drag a section... create a region... name it... there it is in the box... add it into the track where you like... excellent.... i found this a tad easier than VST's rather cryptic Pool, which always baffles me a bit....
the mixer is lush... and the FX are PLENTIFUL... and very good..... the reverb is nice.... and the fx are easy on the eye, and easy to manipulate the settings.... simple sliders.... but all in a tasty easy to look at colour scheme..... toos of eq types included.....
well.......i'm starting to get happy.... and i have a horrible feeling, that i'm gonna fall in love with Logic..... oh GOD !!....
BUT.... my comments at first still stand.... it is so illogical... i honestly would not have stood a chance without some simple tuition..... manuals are very hard to wade thru to glean out the info you need to get going...
If i was working at logic... i'd seriously think about re-jigging a few of the icons... wel... ALL OF THEM FRANKLY......... and the layout needs a little work too.... after all.... i'm only a dumb musician.......
bloody excellent proggie so far..... and hey... it still hasn't crashed !!!..... so i wanna see what i can get out of it, on an old 200MMX..... if i can get some, i'd rather learn it, than have to upgrade stuff and fuck about to get VST to work..... I LOVE my tahiti card.... so this proggie seems to allow it to work....
anyhows... i'm off for an indian ..... i'm gonna leave it running while I'm gone... and see if it is still running when i get back in a few hours... a task i should say VST has never accomplished... i lways come home to a frozen screen... (TB card dontcha know !!)... adios.... WELL worth a good demo at a good store....
Message 18/33 05-Oct-98 @ 01:46 PM - RE: Is LOGIC AUDIO really that good ?
how does logic handle stuff like controller data? can you draw it in like in cakewalk?
and for audio, can you draw in volume and pan envelopes across the tracks (like you can do in acid?) or are you restricted to using some other kind of automation - can't remember if i read that in a logic review or not.
i like the look of it though. cakewalk's drum tracks are beginning to get me down....
and for audio, can you draw in volume and pan envelopes across the tracks (like you can do in acid?) or are you restricted to using some other kind of automation - can't remember if i read that in a logic review or not.
i like the look of it though. cakewalk's drum tracks are beginning to get me down....
Message 19/33 05-Oct-98 @ 01:59 PM - RE: Is LOGIC AUDIO really that good ?
Damn Kilo, I can see how you've written that whole post as I was guiding you through it.. Totally bagging it like nothing else at the start, and towards the end becoming really excited about it. I honestly don't think it's as illogical as Cubase, which I had loads of trouble with years ago when friends would bring it over with their tracks on it ready to record. To me, that boot thing is still a big wank, and I'm glad Emagic have never implemented crap like that. Although, i'm sure Cubase users worship it as if it were God.
Anyway, I've played with all 3 sequencers, and I still think Logic is way ahead. I mean, look at most of the new features in VST 4.0. There's ployphony reduction, screensets, 4 arpeggiators (Logic has an unlimited number), customizable key commands, folder tracks, 8 aux fx slots (Logic 3 had them), 64 audio tracks (Logic has 96), inserts on every channel..and a few other things. Logic audio has had this stuff for ages !!! Most of these it's had since version 1.0. of Logic. Things like polyphony reduction.
Guys, I don't know why you were saying that the audio side of Logic isn't very good. Have you tried version 3.5 yet? It's got Direct X support, so it's up there with Cakewalk, but there's no VST plug-in support yet, except on the mac version. I love the mixer in this latest version, especially as it appears in screenset 8, with all the tracks in the order they are displayed on the arrange page.
Another thing, as much as I dig the way in which the drum editor (Hyperedit) works, I still wouldn't trust the midi timing of a pc based sequencer, and will always use my MPC3000 where possible. One thing I've heard, is that if you're using the unitor 8 interface, it will give you hardware sequencer quality timing for any external midi sources.
Yeah, I'll be using Logic from now on for it's audio capabilities. I would have been using it in this way a year ago, apart from the fact that it never had effects then. Now it does, and has direct X support also, so I'm extra happy. The way the mixer is laid out is a lot like a real mixer. You don't get extra boxes appearing all over the place when you go to change the eq on a channel, as is the case with VST. Recommended !!
Anyway, I've played with all 3 sequencers, and I still think Logic is way ahead. I mean, look at most of the new features in VST 4.0. There's ployphony reduction, screensets, 4 arpeggiators (Logic has an unlimited number), customizable key commands, folder tracks, 8 aux fx slots (Logic 3 had them), 64 audio tracks (Logic has 96), inserts on every channel..and a few other things. Logic audio has had this stuff for ages !!! Most of these it's had since version 1.0. of Logic. Things like polyphony reduction.
Guys, I don't know why you were saying that the audio side of Logic isn't very good. Have you tried version 3.5 yet? It's got Direct X support, so it's up there with Cakewalk, but there's no VST plug-in support yet, except on the mac version. I love the mixer in this latest version, especially as it appears in screenset 8, with all the tracks in the order they are displayed on the arrange page.
Another thing, as much as I dig the way in which the drum editor (Hyperedit) works, I still wouldn't trust the midi timing of a pc based sequencer, and will always use my MPC3000 where possible. One thing I've heard, is that if you're using the unitor 8 interface, it will give you hardware sequencer quality timing for any external midi sources.
Yeah, I'll be using Logic from now on for it's audio capabilities. I would have been using it in this way a year ago, apart from the fact that it never had effects then. Now it does, and has direct X support also, so I'm extra happy. The way the mixer is laid out is a lot like a real mixer. You don't get extra boxes appearing all over the place when you go to change the eq on a channel, as is the case with VST. Recommended !!
Message 20/33 05-Oct-98 @ 02:14 PM - RE: Is LOGIC AUDIO really that good ?
You can draw anything. On the arrange page it's like acid, but you can draw controller messages, filter sweeps, panning etc, with audio or midi data.. you have to zoom in a bit though to see it all. There's also Hyperedit, which has the same drawing facilities, and this is where you draw drum notes aswell.
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