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Forums - Music techology
Subject: Does VST really work on a PC?
Viewing all 21 messages - View by pages of 10: 1 2 3
Original Message 1/21 23-Jul-98 @ 08:40 AM - Does VST really work on a PC?
I've been "evaluating" Radiums latest crack on Cubase VST 3.553 and it doesn't work. It freezes every 10-30 min. So I consider to buy the original. But I've heard that it doesn't help 'cos it doesn't work either? What do you think. Is it worth buying? What should I use instead?
Message 2/21 23-Jul-98 @ 09:08 AM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
2 choices..... find someone who does have a working system...... go and see it work...all day..... and do a midi timing check on it..... get a list of the config of the pc... build it... and even then , it may not work... it seems that vst on the pc likes only certain hardware.... the gina seems to work ok... but there are folks with it going on other systems too....... best advice..... get a cheap old dx pc or above... and use that as the sequencer or an atari 1040 with cubase... sync up the vst on the powerful pc...... with a midi cable from sequencer pc out to audio pc in... run the other vst machine as audio only... or another audio proggie whatever you choose.... or try cakewalk on your machine... it's the only s/w sequencer of the biggies written on the pc platform from go..... and it shows..... VST needs some serious work, but i reckon S'burg are going to leave it behind for the pc..... the mac version for V4 is out... note no pc version......... it's ok for some music... but i dunno... it's a 30/70 chance against to get a pc version going with rock solid midi timing...
however... i'm going to try to get a config that does work... to my complaining bastard standards... cos i'd like to sell vst systems when dancetech starts to retail... .. if i cant get a config that i can 1000% guarantee to be solid.... that i would consider working with..... i wont bother.... no matter how much money can be made selling systems with it.....
i have a major pc manufacturer willing to take the s/w and do lab tests with hardware until we either give up... or get a hardware list and config that works... ....i expect 16 audio tracks... and totally rock solid midi timing... as a minimum figure... otherwise, i'll forget it.....
no offence to steinberg.... they do some good stuff...... but..... sorry...... it aint good enuff in my opinion to release a so-called sequencer that cant keep time in the MAJORITY of systems... sure we can accept a minority of bad cases... but not like it is now.....
if this sounds harsh..... sorry.... Clemens reckons he's got a 100% solid system... he posted the specs over in the cubase chat area.....trouble is... you have to spend a grand before you find out if it works... if it doesnt... tough.... keep spending, changing, upgrading etc etc....
i'm gonna try an NT system as well... but who will pay ?... cos it'll add 300 quid to the price for the OS...
by the way...... 3.55 crack ??... blimey..... it's just so frustrating.. i hve no probs with the audio side at all...... that aint the problem.....
try the cakewalk demo.....
however... i'm going to try to get a config that does work... to my complaining bastard standards... cos i'd like to sell vst systems when dancetech starts to retail... .. if i cant get a config that i can 1000% guarantee to be solid.... that i would consider working with..... i wont bother.... no matter how much money can be made selling systems with it.....
i have a major pc manufacturer willing to take the s/w and do lab tests with hardware until we either give up... or get a hardware list and config that works... ....i expect 16 audio tracks... and totally rock solid midi timing... as a minimum figure... otherwise, i'll forget it.....
no offence to steinberg.... they do some good stuff...... but..... sorry...... it aint good enuff in my opinion to release a so-called sequencer that cant keep time in the MAJORITY of systems... sure we can accept a minority of bad cases... but not like it is now.....
if this sounds harsh..... sorry.... Clemens reckons he's got a 100% solid system... he posted the specs over in the cubase chat area.....trouble is... you have to spend a grand before you find out if it works... if it doesnt... tough.... keep spending, changing, upgrading etc etc....
i'm gonna try an NT system as well... but who will pay ?... cos it'll add 300 quid to the price for the OS...
by the way...... 3.55 crack ??... blimey..... it's just so frustrating.. i hve no probs with the audio side at all...... that aint the problem.....
try the cakewalk demo.....
Message 3/21 23-Jul-98 @ 10:37 AM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
What about using Cool edit pro with a working sequencer proggy? Has anyone tied that one out?
Message 4/21 23-Jul-98 @ 10:54 AM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
Kilo, You'll find NT is slower for audio bit's and bobs. It's more stable, but as NT implements s/w multitasking it's actually slower.
Message 5/21 23-Jul-98 @ 05:21 PM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
My dad works for a TV station around here and Steinberg makes alot of the stuff they use so when the music department there wanted a new sequencer they got Cubase VST on evaluation from Steinberg. They have PC's in the music department cuz all their Macs are used for video stuff. Anyways they tried everything to get it runnging right and it wouldn't. They went to Cakewalk. They haven't had any problems since. I'm sure Cubase works on someones machine but any buddy I know who has tried to run hasn't been able to use it properly yet.
Message 6/21 23-Jul-98 @ 06:17 PM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
apro, did this crack have wavelab and rebirth and a load of other stuff too?
Message 7/21 23-Jul-98 @ 06:38 PM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
Hi!
What should I say? It really depends on the HW AND Software- stuff, running on the VST machine.
Maybe its because I have only VST, WaveLab, EasyCD PRO, some little midi- and audio utilities running on my "Music" PC.
In some cases its possible to adjust the timing behaviour of the system when doing some optimizing jobs within the ASIO setup. But some systems stay "dirty" in combination with VST.
I do have no trouble with sync/ timing, but it MUST BE the major job of Steinberg to stabilize VST timing.
Ciao
Clemens
What should I say? It really depends on the HW AND Software- stuff, running on the VST machine.
Maybe its because I have only VST, WaveLab, EasyCD PRO, some little midi- and audio utilities running on my "Music" PC.
In some cases its possible to adjust the timing behaviour of the system when doing some optimizing jobs within the ASIO setup. But some systems stay "dirty" in combination with VST.
I do have no trouble with sync/ timing, but it MUST BE the major job of Steinberg to stabilize VST timing.
Ciao
Clemens
Message 8/21 23-Jul-98 @ 06:46 PM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
Oh NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!
I was gonna get VST tommorow... I'd been planning to get it for ages! Now WHAT?!??? What am I gonna do NoW?
I've got the VST demo and the timing seems to work okay with my Terratec but it does crash all the time and I have to re-install it (the demo) all the time... what does this mean?!? I have no idea!
Shall I get VST then? Yeah, it does a perfect machine-gun drum roll. So does this mean the timing is OK?
Help!
I was gonna get VST tommorow... I'd been planning to get it for ages! Now WHAT?!??? What am I gonna do NoW?
I've got the VST demo and the timing seems to work okay with my Terratec but it does crash all the time and I have to re-install it (the demo) all the time... what does this mean?!? I have no idea!
Shall I get VST then? Yeah, it does a perfect machine-gun drum roll. So does this mean the timing is OK?
Help!
Message 9/21 23-Jul-98 @ 07:18 PM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
No, I'm totally wrong! In Denial! The timing works with my original version of Cubasis but NOT with the VST demo!
I'm used to the Cubase format so what am I going to do as an alternative to VST? I was looking forward to using them Audio plug-ins! FUCK! FUCK! FUCK!
I'm used to the Cubase format so what am I going to do as an alternative to VST? I was looking forward to using them Audio plug-ins! FUCK! FUCK! FUCK!
Message 10/21 23-Jul-98 @ 07:19 PM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
Sorry about this .... i'm in Dire Straits!
Whats the timing in Logic like?
Whats the timing in Logic like?
Message 11/21 23-Jul-98 @ 08:21 PM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
An advice: don't buy anything from the following brands:
Microsoft, Steinberg, Sony (except a playstation), Roland, Creative Labs
You'll feel much better afterwards... so don't go with the flow; f*ck the mainstream and get Cakewalk --- its g-r-e-a-t!
Microsoft, Steinberg, Sony (except a playstation), Roland, Creative Labs
You'll feel much better afterwards... so don't go with the flow; f*ck the mainstream and get Cakewalk --- its g-r-e-a-t!
Message 12/21 23-Jul-98 @ 08:46 PM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
Hello
I used to use cubasis for making drum and bass music and have recently upgraded to cubase vst. I have had the program 2 weeks and every time I try to get two drum loops in time they drift out again. I have a cyrix 233 mmx, is it because cubase is not compatible with this system?
If so what is a better sequencer as every thing I make on vst goes completly out of time!
I used to use cubasis for making drum and bass music and have recently upgraded to cubase vst. I have had the program 2 weeks and every time I try to get two drum loops in time they drift out again. I have a cyrix 233 mmx, is it because cubase is not compatible with this system?
If so what is a better sequencer as every thing I make on vst goes completly out of time!
Message 13/21 23-Jul-98 @ 09:26 PM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
Browngirl: get Cakewalk 7. It supports audio plugins, has solid timing, is more stable than VST on a PC, and is in my opinion easier to use than VST. You can download a demo at www.cakewalk.com.
Message 14/21 24-Jul-98 @ 12:26 AM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
fuck.....what can i say.....
i used to love cubase.....but i'm 4 months into a legit version of vst...
when i use it on my 233, i can only use a little chorus on the vocals...anything more in the effects department, and the midi (only use maybe 4 or 5 tracks!)...well it aint in time..i'll tell you that!!!
What i nightmare!!!
My oppinion..... the fucking crack is just as stable!!! Really!...can't believe it
Oh..and if your "used to" Cubase...Logic will do your bleedin head in!!!
Wonder what my friendly Steinburg rep will say when i ask him to swap to Cakewalk..?? I'm fucking serious...off to see him again tommorrow....he he!!!
i used to love cubase.....but i'm 4 months into a legit version of vst...
when i use it on my 233, i can only use a little chorus on the vocals...anything more in the effects department, and the midi (only use maybe 4 or 5 tracks!)...well it aint in time..i'll tell you that!!!
What i nightmare!!!
My oppinion..... the fucking crack is just as stable!!! Really!...can't believe it
Oh..and if your "used to" Cubase...Logic will do your bleedin head in!!!
Wonder what my friendly Steinburg rep will say when i ask him to swap to Cakewalk..?? I'm fucking serious...off to see him again tommorrow....he he!!!
Message 15/21 24-Jul-98 @ 12:54 AM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
well, Clemens is THE man for VST... now.... as he says...and as i said above... get the right hardware combi.... and tweak & tweak it... it can work...... BUT... you have to accept that you're gonna have to buy another pc for your other work, OR... as long as you add no hardware extra's.... add-in a removable boot drive tray with 2 win 95 boot drives.... one for VST & the few music apps... and the other for your other junk... BUT... if you add in extra hardware AT ALL..... then the VST boot will see it on boot..... even if you disable ti from a profile, it'll maybe still affect the VST version drive..... you could disable plug & prey...
in the end.... 1500 quid is alot to spend for a system that may or may not work....
as i said... i will try to get a 100% solid config... there is a majior PC builder crop, who have agreed to bench test various set-ups for me until we give up, or get a stable system.... then I want to run it into the ground endlessly for a week.... and see if it crashes too often... my mmx 200 (64mb sdram) for example doesnt really have a prob with the audio side... I'm happy with 8-12 tracks of audio... and it glitches sometimes... and sometimes it looses the audio and then you restart it and it is there..... active-X V5 is required for sure... certain web browsers etc can add wrong versions etc.....
anyways... if the PC company & I DO get a solid version... I'll sell it here... as a SEALED STAND ALONE SYSTEM ONLY... parts warranteed... but it will only be guaranteed to work, if you DONT add anything to the system....... that is the deal.... I think say 1500 with a decent card & the proggie, is NOT too much to pay for a stand alone system with that power... after all.... you'd pay that for a h/d recorder, adat etc......
have to register & start the company first... but realistically, it will be in the autumn before this is sorted as there is a shit load of stuff to do......
would say tho... at that price MAC's start to get competitive,... funnily, i met a guy on the station platform today reading FM mag...we started talking, & he said he & his mate invested in VST on a P2.... and yes... it is fucked... poor guy.....
funnily tho, even tho my soundcard is 100% not compatible with vst... i dont get too much crashing, or audio probs... just midi timing.....
maybe the real answer is a ww cubase users joint legal action against Steinberg... they would win for sure..... i mean can you imagine if say Photoshop did this...... no way would Adobe release it..... but musicians are dumn fucks with no collective brain or power... after al... that is how all the music industry can keep fucking us over right ??... cos essentially musicians are greedy ego obsessed competitive wankers..... who wouldnt get together if their very lives depended on it... well, except maybe for mutual ego-stroking sessions at awards ceremonies
it is a sad situation for sure..... could be an awesome proggie that VST if it was written RIGHT... I reckon steinberg need to get together with M'Soft... and derive a special OS for running VST.... it should be possible..... but business is business..... shame someone here doesnt know a top MS bod who could get a MSoft team on it.....
maybe we need a ww music users association (including manufacturers) to lobby Msoft, and the rest of the PC industry and work on joint ventures to get a music version OS with a fixed property for all music s/w developers..... even to get a special M'board with a dedicated midi bus... BUT ... tell the dealers etc that and they will wine ... "But we make our money selling midi cards.... ".....
still... i doubt that'll happen... it could... but i doubt it...... this aint an ideal world lets face it..... and that is revolutionary talk lets face it.....
in the end.... 1500 quid is alot to spend for a system that may or may not work....
as i said... i will try to get a 100% solid config... there is a majior PC builder crop, who have agreed to bench test various set-ups for me until we give up, or get a stable system.... then I want to run it into the ground endlessly for a week.... and see if it crashes too often... my mmx 200 (64mb sdram) for example doesnt really have a prob with the audio side... I'm happy with 8-12 tracks of audio... and it glitches sometimes... and sometimes it looses the audio and then you restart it and it is there..... active-X V5 is required for sure... certain web browsers etc can add wrong versions etc.....
anyways... if the PC company & I DO get a solid version... I'll sell it here... as a SEALED STAND ALONE SYSTEM ONLY... parts warranteed... but it will only be guaranteed to work, if you DONT add anything to the system....... that is the deal.... I think say 1500 with a decent card & the proggie, is NOT too much to pay for a stand alone system with that power... after all.... you'd pay that for a h/d recorder, adat etc......
have to register & start the company first... but realistically, it will be in the autumn before this is sorted as there is a shit load of stuff to do......
would say tho... at that price MAC's start to get competitive,... funnily, i met a guy on the station platform today reading FM mag...we started talking, & he said he & his mate invested in VST on a P2.... and yes... it is fucked... poor guy.....
funnily tho, even tho my soundcard is 100% not compatible with vst... i dont get too much crashing, or audio probs... just midi timing.....
maybe the real answer is a ww cubase users joint legal action against Steinberg... they would win for sure..... i mean can you imagine if say Photoshop did this...... no way would Adobe release it..... but musicians are dumn fucks with no collective brain or power... after al... that is how all the music industry can keep fucking us over right ??... cos essentially musicians are greedy ego obsessed competitive wankers..... who wouldnt get together if their very lives depended on it... well, except maybe for mutual ego-stroking sessions at awards ceremonies
it is a sad situation for sure..... could be an awesome proggie that VST if it was written RIGHT... I reckon steinberg need to get together with M'Soft... and derive a special OS for running VST.... it should be possible..... but business is business..... shame someone here doesnt know a top MS bod who could get a MSoft team on it.....
maybe we need a ww music users association (including manufacturers) to lobby Msoft, and the rest of the PC industry and work on joint ventures to get a music version OS with a fixed property for all music s/w developers..... even to get a special M'board with a dedicated midi bus... BUT ... tell the dealers etc that and they will wine ... "But we make our money selling midi cards.... ".....
still... i doubt that'll happen... it could... but i doubt it...... this aint an ideal world lets face it..... and that is revolutionary talk lets face it.....
Message 16/21 24-Jul-98 @ 06:21 AM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
Not to mention that the OS would probably cost a fortune. In the US a few governments complained to microsoft about games coming with Win95 (solitaire and the like) saying that it decreased productivity because their workers spent to much time playing the games. They asked Microsoft to make a package that didn't include the games (why they didn't erase them themselves is beyond me). Microsofts solution; Windows 95 Government Edition. Same OS without the games and they charge almost twice as much! My point being any company would charge a premium for it. It would be really cool though. And Kilo is right if musicians banded together and lobbied things would change. As it is a lot of people buy Cubase even knowing it may not work right. That's gotta change. How bout a Steinberg embargo (I don't know if I can llive without Rebirth though!).
arsenaul@niagara.com
arsenaul@niagara.com
Message 17/21 24-Jul-98 @ 06:57 AM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
WELL I'VE JUST TRIED OUT CAKEWALK 7.... YES... YES !!... Y-E-E-E-E-S !!!!!!!!!!!!!
Message 18/21 24-Jul-98 @ 09:08 AM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
Yesterday evening I had a telephone call to one of my friends (oh, I didn´t talk to him for month :-)).
He works with Logic on PC. I asked him about timing and sync....... and........ he had some troubles too.
Finally, he re- installed WIN95(98) and Logic. As he told me, WIN98 is more stable concerning timing.
Hey kilo, what about your contacts to Steinberg? What do they say to you? There´s a rumor that the next updates (VST for PC, I don´t mean version 4.0 for MAC) will be much more stable (Steinberg told me about update steps they plan for VST PC-version, maybe versions 3.6, 3.8 and finally 4.0).
They really must be in a market-pool-position. Why can they wait so long. The informantion flow from Steinberg to the customer is so sluggish.....
What the fuck do they do? The idea for a virtual studio technology is great and the handling of VST is much more better than other seqnencers do (hey, Logic is a real shit concerning handling, too much information on one screen, too much screens, etc.).... Steinberg could be much more successful........
I hope, some guys from Steinberg visits this Chatline and read carefully all those messages from the users out there.
Why can they be so ignorant?
Should we make some mailing action to Steibnerg and give them a kick in their ass? But that shouldn´t be the job of an customer !!!! What do they think about marketing, after sales service, customer support, hotline service.....
It must be a real German company (well I´m from Germany too). They dunno much about customer service !!!!! They are arrogant and ignorant.
I have had very good experience with some American software companies, as for example Opcode.
Their response to customer problems is good, their hotline works very fine (you´ll never wait more than 2 days for an answer).........
Fucking bullshit, Cubase is a great sequencing software and could be much better without this silly timing and sync shit........
Hope, they will get rid of this trouble
Ciao
Clemens
He works with Logic on PC. I asked him about timing and sync....... and........ he had some troubles too.
Finally, he re- installed WIN95(98) and Logic. As he told me, WIN98 is more stable concerning timing.
Hey kilo, what about your contacts to Steinberg? What do they say to you? There´s a rumor that the next updates (VST for PC, I don´t mean version 4.0 for MAC) will be much more stable (Steinberg told me about update steps they plan for VST PC-version, maybe versions 3.6, 3.8 and finally 4.0).
They really must be in a market-pool-position. Why can they wait so long. The informantion flow from Steinberg to the customer is so sluggish.....
What the fuck do they do? The idea for a virtual studio technology is great and the handling of VST is much more better than other seqnencers do (hey, Logic is a real shit concerning handling, too much information on one screen, too much screens, etc.).... Steinberg could be much more successful........
I hope, some guys from Steinberg visits this Chatline and read carefully all those messages from the users out there.
Why can they be so ignorant?
Should we make some mailing action to Steibnerg and give them a kick in their ass? But that shouldn´t be the job of an customer !!!! What do they think about marketing, after sales service, customer support, hotline service.....
It must be a real German company (well I´m from Germany too). They dunno much about customer service !!!!! They are arrogant and ignorant.
I have had very good experience with some American software companies, as for example Opcode.
Their response to customer problems is good, their hotline works very fine (you´ll never wait more than 2 days for an answer).........
Fucking bullshit, Cubase is a great sequencing software and could be much better without this silly timing and sync shit........
Hope, they will get rid of this trouble
Ciao
Clemens
Message 19/21 24-Jul-98 @ 09:12 AM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
.......... and again:
Never, really never install this fucking Internet Explorer with Active Desktop on your music PC (WIN95).
Ciao
Never, really never install this fucking Internet Explorer with Active Desktop on your music PC (WIN95).
Ciao
Message 20/21 24-Jul-98 @ 03:13 PM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
I still think that Logic leaves all those other sequencers for dead. VST has too many crappy little windows that appear and you can't set up screen sets on there. Well, not that I know of. I hate those windows, as there seems to be a separate one for everything, fx, master fx, channel, master, mixer, etc etc, and they're really annoying.
Logic has a much better system. In the new 3.5 versions there's a mixer that displays all the channels in the order they appear in the tracks list. It goes off, and all the eq setting appear on the channels aswell, which is a lot better than separate boxes for each channel that take up the entire space of the screen, like in VST. The timing is much better aswell.
Cakewalk is pretty good, but there's nothing in it that can match Logic's Hyperedit. I don't like Cakewalks arrange page. The boxes never go to the end of the bar which sux.
Logic has a much better system. In the new 3.5 versions there's a mixer that displays all the channels in the order they appear in the tracks list. It goes off, and all the eq setting appear on the channels aswell, which is a lot better than separate boxes for each channel that take up the entire space of the screen, like in VST. The timing is much better aswell.
Cakewalk is pretty good, but there's nothing in it that can match Logic's Hyperedit. I don't like Cakewalks arrange page. The boxes never go to the end of the bar which sux.
Message 21/21 24-Jul-98 @ 08:35 PM - RE: Does VST really work on a PC?
well.... Micheal Marshall at steinberg has invited me to hamburg to meet them..... when i talked on the phoe to him I talked about the vst probs and his answer was... "No no... we have a p166 here and it works fine !"...
as i say... i dont have a real prob with the audio side of Vst... any probs i do have is all about cos i use a non-compatible old soundcard so vst loses it sometimes... but audio timing is ok works fine...... the problem is the fucking midi timing.... maybe steinberg dont do dance music !!... cos i can see how with other material, it would appear that vst timing is ok.... for general sequencing the timing probs dont appear... but for house etc any fast regular sequenced drums or arpegiattions it's like listening to a car engine with bad timing... sure it drives to work fine... sure it doesnt break down... but when you sit at the traffic lights waiting to go, and listen to the engine ticking over, you can hear the little coughs and splutters as the engine rises and falls slightly...... that on a car means the distributor timing or static timing is slightly out... now... for day to day car use, that is fine... but for competitive track racing....no way... that slight timing discrepency means slower acceleration and a non-competitive bike or car.... that to me, is the perfect analogy of vst.... and dance sequencing is the race track equivilent of car or bike racing
shit.. if only i could set the vst timing on the pc with a feeler guage and dial guage...heh.....
kilo
as i say... i dont have a real prob with the audio side of Vst... any probs i do have is all about cos i use a non-compatible old soundcard so vst loses it sometimes... but audio timing is ok works fine...... the problem is the fucking midi timing.... maybe steinberg dont do dance music !!... cos i can see how with other material, it would appear that vst timing is ok.... for general sequencing the timing probs dont appear... but for house etc any fast regular sequenced drums or arpegiattions it's like listening to a car engine with bad timing... sure it drives to work fine... sure it doesnt break down... but when you sit at the traffic lights waiting to go, and listen to the engine ticking over, you can hear the little coughs and splutters as the engine rises and falls slightly...... that on a car means the distributor timing or static timing is slightly out... now... for day to day car use, that is fine... but for competitive track racing....no way... that slight timing discrepency means slower acceleration and a non-competitive bike or car.... that to me, is the perfect analogy of vst.... and dance sequencing is the race track equivilent of car or bike racing
shit.. if only i could set the vst timing on the pc with a feeler guage and dial guage...heh.....
kilo
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