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Subject: swing and groove secrets

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Original Message Date: 28-Jan-04 @ 05:13 PM - swing and groove secrets

James Burnett

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A question on swing and groove if anyones prepared to give up their secrets. You'll get good karma, I promise. How do you people go about injecting some groove in your club tracks. I've been using swing B in Logic and it works OK but I'm not entirely sure how to use swing properly. If I decide to move the 2 and 4 16th notes later by 21 ticks (swing B), then should I make sure that I use this swing setting on everything including all the drums and the bass and all the music?

I was reading that classic hip hop tracks keep the drums strictly quantised but swing the bass whereas classic funk tracks swing the drums but have a strictly quantised bass. I'm making (trying) underground house tracks and I reckon having everything strictly quantised is the best groove but this can't be right cos when I cut up all my favourite tracks (of CD, not vinyl), they seem to have some of their snares, percussion, etc that fall on the 2nd and 4th 16th notes (from what I can make out) on 21 and 41 ticks but when I attempt to do it, its sound sloppy and not tight.

Maybe I'm over analysing but surely groove can't just be about velocity and compression? How do you guys swing your tracks, have everything on the same swing setting or maybe slightly swing the main drums by say 6 ticks and swing the hats and shakers by 21 ticks? Do you think that�s the best way of looking at it?

I'm using my ears, I promise!!!

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Message 21/80 05-Feb-04 @ 02:58 PM - RE: swing and groove secrets

Jory

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No problems mate. Now if someone could give me a straight answer to my bass vsti question then that would be cool.

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Message 22/80 05-Feb-04 @ 03:16 PM - RE: swing and groove secrets

dubmunkey

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would love to but am a hardware head...i would be merely speculating..

greg

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Message 23/80 05-Feb-04 @ 06:04 PM - RE: swing and groove secrets

Pongoid

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Jory, I did. Read it. Then read it again. Your answer is in there.

As for the swing thing, it REALLY is an ear thing. For example check out cats like Vogel. Things are swung all over the place, some none at all in the same groove, but it all works because he's using his ears to tell him what goes where. Trying to equate it down to 'ticks' is not gonna get you a human swing feel. It's going to get you a calculated syncopation. Both have their place, but one is not the other.

Another thing to keep in mind is to pay attention to others' compositions whose feel you are trying to approximate/interpret and figure out where the sounds are NOT falling. For example the hat placement, the kicks, etc..

Ape

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Message 24/80 06-Feb-04 @ 10:01 AM - RE: swing and groove secrets

dubmunkey

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i find swing only useful for house beats and such certainly not looser grooves like hiphop, dub, funk or even faster stuff like dnb.....

greg

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Message 25/80 08-Feb-04 @ 06:33 AM - RE: swing and groove secrets

MCC>

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i couldn't think of anything more ridiculous than establishing one's entire
musical identity upon nothing more than a software's implentation of a single mathematical algorithim which determines swing-tick placement.
swing c?!
each and EVERY song he does uses this?

yowzA....that's exactly the sorta thing i do purciate being wurned about.
it's amazing what passes for underground anymore....or why people even bother using the term since it's relevance is increasingly miniscule.

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Message 26/80 08-Feb-04 @ 06:49 PM - RE: swing and groove secrets

xoxos

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for generations all the old musos have been saying "ha ha, you think the music lost soul because your generation passed on" - maybe while everyone was repeating this and feeling assured, the new generation really did die

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Message 27/80 09-Feb-04 @ 07:11 AM - RE: swing and groove secrets

Dr Dude

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MCC and Xoxoxs - you are either both very old or American. Certainly, you have no idea about underground house.

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Message 28/80 09-Feb-04 @ 07:55 AM - RE: swing and groove secrets

psylichon

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lol..... oooooooooooooooo!

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Message 29/80 09-Feb-04 @ 08:58 AM - RE: swing and groove secrets

Garuna

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Message 30/80 09-Feb-04 @ 12:43 PM - RE: swing and groove secrets

A London Bod

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hahahhahahh -true. Don't you know about 16B (Omid) who named himself after the 16b swing in Logic. He had a critically claimed house album in 1997 and is more worthy than any of you rubbishers. People don't know their house on here and are happy to throw out random comments that don't mean anything..

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