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Forums - Music techology
Subject: swing and groove secrets
Original Message Date: 28-Jan-04 @ 05:13 PM - swing and groove secrets
I was reading that classic hip hop tracks keep the drums strictly quantised but swing the bass whereas classic funk tracks swing the drums but have a strictly quantised bass. I'm making (trying) underground house tracks and I reckon having everything strictly quantised is the best groove but this can't be right cos when I cut up all my favourite tracks (of CD, not vinyl), they seem to have some of their snares, percussion, etc that fall on the 2nd and 4th 16th notes (from what I can make out) on 21 and 41 ticks but when I attempt to do it, its sound sloppy and not tight.
Maybe I'm over analysing but surely groove can't just be about velocity and compression? How do you guys swing your tracks, have everything on the same swing setting or maybe slightly swing the main drums by say 6 ticks and swing the hats and shakers by 21 ticks? Do you think that’s the best way of looking at it?
I'm using my ears, I promise!!!
Message 31/80 09-Feb-04 @ 02:15 PM Edit: 09-Feb-04 | 02:16 PM - RE: swing and groove secrets
who listens to house anyways who's under 30? (could be an arguement also) - I cant think of anyone who listens to house who isnt basicaly a cheezy quaver in the eyes of most teenagers..
lol
but perhaps that's just a 'London thing'
___________________________________
I had an idea for a script once. It's basically Jaws except when the guys in the boat are going after Jaws, they look around and there's an even bigger Jaws. The guys have to team up with Jaws to get Bigger Jaws.... I call it... Big Jaws!!!
Message 32/80 09-Feb-04 @ 03:15 PM - RE: swing and groove secrets
down our way the young un's are into dnb and the old un's are into techno ..... both seem to lsten to that horrible hardhouse shite....then again thats the south for ya!
greg
Message 33/80 09-Feb-04 @ 03:35 PM - RE: swing and groove secrets
haha...that took a great deal of insight.
but one day, you too will be listening to some same-old stuff and seeing some kids run about as though the true-originators of a "new" progressive sound and...you too will be going bah!
and i will laugh with you.
it's just how it is. and some of it will actually be totally cool.
and that, too, is also how it is.
of course i enjoy house-music and countless other styles but i'd never suggest it was that original....not that originality is god.....but it helps occasionally when one is no longer tied to the cradle or to the
herd....flock....ensemble....congregation.
everybody's gotta believe in something...after all.
anyway....
Message 34/80 09-Feb-04 @ 04:00 PM - RE: swing and groove secrets
with house production i found this 'magic logic swing' equated to 60% on the mpc, so what? well yeah exactly.... but it does mean i can turn the swing on..bang in a rhythm and it will be nearer to how i want it to groove (of course ill find myself in step edit for the next 2 hours) but its nice to be able to play a beat in and not have to think 'oh i must go and move all those 2nd and 4th 16th notes 4 ticks....
16b eh? i guess its like james originally mentioned- 21 ticks.....cool...thats another setting to play with...
greg
Message 35/80 09-Feb-04 @ 10:24 PM - RE: swing and groove secrets
yes.
i know i learned something.
Message 36/80 10-Feb-04 @ 12:45 PM - RE: swing and groove secrets
Message 37/80 10-Feb-04 @ 03:25 PM - RE: swing and groove secrets
Message 38/80 10-Feb-04 @ 05:53 PM - RE: swing and groove secrets
Ape
Message 39/80 10-Feb-04 @ 07:41 PM - RE: swing and groove secrets
Don't you guys PLAY your music? Any of you?
I'm not suggesting that it all must be played live into sequencers... but do any of you actually drum? or play notes on keyboards/controllers... or LISTEN to the way poly rythms work together?
Jesus, is their such a specific recipe that you know the LOGIC formula for it? No wonder "underground" all sounds the same, IT REALLY IS... you know this why people say electronic music isn't creative. Thing is, I love house, especially deep groovin' house. But come on, there's more to groove than using a quantization preset!
try drumming, guys. Learn rythm, there's nothing more important to building rythmic music than knowing how to drum. Then you can play your notes in... quantize to taste, not to recipe...
Quit looking for simple tricks that make it easier... easy music is uninspired, uninteresting.
At slower tempos, like house, some breakbeat, etc... you have a lot of room to play with timing, set notes a bit off of the mark. Tweak your sixteenths, and try setting snares off a bit. Don't swing your kicks (usualy, wierdness knows no advices) and PLAY with it... Use your ears ... if it ain't working don't do it. Drummers don't keep playing out of time, if it doesn't work, they switch it up. If you don't have the ears for pploy rythms (that's waht it is when you start creating syncopations with different timing, and beat placement) then develop them. If it ain't workin', you may be in the wrong biz!
But I'm not being mentioned in DJ Magazine, so i may not know what I'm talking about... of course, just 'cause you have a contract doesn't mean you know sh+t either! But that's a different argument innit?
e
Message 40/80 10-Feb-04 @ 08:58 PM - RE: swing and groove secrets
oh 61!
ya so overgrown and overground you ridiculous patsy....pretender.
ticket please.
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