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Subject: bass vsti

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Original Message 1/42 02-Feb-04 @ 08:24 AM - bass vsti

Jory

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What is the best bass VSTi? Trilogy doesn't fit into the mix, Albino is great at leads but shit at bass and the es2 only does "trancey" basses. Bass is the only bit I'm stuck on.

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Message 2/42 02-Feb-04 @ 09:06 AM - RE: bass vsti

milan

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oh feck... i just wrote a reply and it got lost in the ether...

short version: logic's synths are actually pretty good for bass, but you may wanna try rolling your own sounds, and so is albino. other than that: Triangle (freebie), freealpha (freebie), and Junglist or Scorpion (not freebies) are supposed to be good too...

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Message 3/42 02-Feb-04 @ 09:17 AM - RE: bass vsti

dARKSTATe

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I've found the old Muon Electron to do some killer basses...

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Message 4/42 02-Feb-04 @ 12:05 PM - RE: bass vsti

Jory

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Thank you for your replies. Milan, you reckon the Albino does good basses? I reckon the albino doesn't. They all sound a bit thin whereas Trilogy is way too thick! I will look at triangle though, thank you.

DS - I will look a this one. Is it a vsti?

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Message 5/42 02-Feb-04 @ 01:12 PM - RE: bass vsti

milan

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yeah... i dunno dude. i guess it may also depend on the rest of the sounds you're using... btw, for simpler bass sounds *do* give ESM a shot... roll the cutoff low, add some nice chorus (blutetubes one is my favourite) and you may be surprised how nicely it fills up the bottom end.

btw... are you after the low bass or something more angry sounding? maybe you need to mess with processing/fx more? good luck...

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Message 6/42 02-Feb-04 @ 01:24 PM - RE: bass vsti

dARKSTATe

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Yup, its a VSTI.. a bit long in the tooth but I've made good use of it..

The only thing I was gonna add to Milan's comment was... EQ?!?

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Message 7/42 02-Feb-04 @ 02:52 PM - RE: bass vsti

BluStudio

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Refx's Vsti's are really good- beast, claw, juno x2

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Message 8/42 02-Feb-04 @ 07:52 PM - RE: bass vsti

influx

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theres that new version of junglist...

Absynth does some SICK bass, too

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Message 9/42 03-Feb-04 @ 10:16 AM - RE: bass vsti

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yeah, depends what type of bass you look for... then use EQ to tweak the frequencies to fit how you like it. 'Bass' sounds is a pretty loose term... what sort of bass you mean

___________________________________

I had an idea for a script once. It's basically Jaws except when the guys in the boat are going after Jaws, they look around and there's an even bigger Jaws. The guys have to team up with Jaws to get Bigger Jaws.... I call it... Big Jaws!!!

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Message 10/42 03-Feb-04 @ 01:38 PM - RE: bass vsti

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I like the Oddity and Arturia Moog Modular

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Message 11/42 03-Feb-04 @ 03:53 PM - RE: bass vsti

Pongoid

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Prophet.

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Message 12/42 03-Feb-04 @ 04:54 PM - RE: bass vsti

digital rust

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man, i'm sorry, but if you can't get good bass out of albino, then you're not
programming it right.

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Message 13/42 03-Feb-04 @ 06:19 PM - RE: bass vsti

Optofonik - AKA, mick, rhyze, etc.

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Waldorf Attack VSTi

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Message 14/42 03-Feb-04 @ 09:23 PM - RE: bass vsti

Broken Silence

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v-station by far is my favorite out of all that have been named.

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Message 15/42 04-Feb-04 @ 11:38 AM - RE: bass vsti

Neil

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I don't know how you can say that those synths are thin or don't sit in the mix - that's what EQ is for.

Pretty much any vsti will produce some deecent bass sounds depending on what you're after. Seeing as no two songs require the same bass sound it follows that no one bass synth is best. Having said that some synths are better at certain sounds than others. Junglist for instance is good at dirty pitch envolpeed jungle and rnb basses cos it has those pitch functions.

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Message 16/42 04-Feb-04 @ 11:41 AM - RE: bass vsti

Jory

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Digital Rust - how the hell would you know? You don't know the type of tracks I'm doing and you don't know about the quality levels I'm aspiring too within my chosen musical style. What a stupid thing to say! Idiot, read my original post.

I own a Waldorf attack and its great at SFX and the odd drum sound but I'd rather stick with Lin Plug stuff for all that. What I need is something that is going to do a thick, bouncy bass sound but sit in the mix properly and not swamp the whole bottom end.

Cheers for all the recommendations chaps. I'll def look at the v-station too.

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Message 17/42 04-Feb-04 @ 12:04 PM - RE: bass vsti

milan

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aye... you're right Jory, digitalrust wouldnt know a thing or two about dirty bass or programming synths. if you listen to his tracks you'll see he's clueless and his sounds suck.

http://www.dancetech.com/members/my_tracks/audio/DT_ACF18EC3786321.mp3

lalala...

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Message 18/42 04-Feb-04 @ 12:54 PM - RE: bass vsti

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well Jory - why doncha add some audio so we can hear what you mean

----

What I need is something that is going to do a thick, bouncy bass sound but sit in the mix properly and not swamp the whole bottom end.

---

well, filter out the very low end to reduce 'swamping' mebbe look at your kik drum freq's to see what's going on and reuce bass in the same range to stop muddiness

Oh - your speakers ARE wired in phase yes? (NOT being in phase severely reduces bass definition)

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Message 19/42 04-Feb-04 @ 12:57 PM - RE: bass vsti

Jory

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Didn't say he doen't know what he's doing IN HIS PARTICULAR STYLE. Its not a style or sound I'm into or want to be into. I'm after thick, funky bassess for house music and Albino doesn't do em. Only my opinion but the basses on my tunes don't stand up to the drums, leads, pads, etc. I reckon bass is the NUMBER 1 hardest thing to do.

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Message 20/42 04-Feb-04 @ 01:19 PM - RE: bass vsti

milan

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yeah sorry... i mixed you up with the guy who was after dirty breakz basses

doh...

anyway... you didnt even SAY what kinda bass you were after. am i supposed to be psychic or what???

the sound you're after... it wouldnt happen to be bass guitar? i know lot of house bods use then...

and i STILL say esm would be good for low end stuff with minimum effort, and Albino does good bass. you do have the presets it ships with, yes?

(wtf is it lately with everyone looking for "fast food" solutions???

)

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Message 21/42 04-Feb-04 @ 01:31 PM - RE: bass vsti

Jory

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Thank you K and Milan. Really appreciate your help as your tracks Milan are kinda more my style. K, I have active tannoy reveals so I hope their all wired up properly. Its just a mains plug and a jack to jack so not sure that there;'s much to get wrong in the setting up stages but you know far more than me so maybe I should check it out. Yer, I kinda tend to lower the filter cutoff on my bass patch building attempts but I'm just not getting the sound I want. I A/B tracks I like all the time via burning them and importing the WAV directly into Logic. I've been careful to set the max level on the faders for the A/B track so I know the A/B track is at the maximum headroom for my desk. When, say there's just the bass playing in the A/B track, I can see that its just hitting the 0db master LED's on my Mackie so I try and set my bass at the same level and all that stuff. Its just that I can't seem top achieve THAT sound. Its definatley a more kinda dubby, sine wave type sound I'm after but with depth and body, not just a pure sine (ala old skool jungle) if that makes sense.

Milan, yer I got the extra box presets with the Albino. You gonna tell me a patch that's a good starting point then?

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Message 22/42 04-Feb-04 @ 01:39 PM - RE: bass vsti

Neil

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Check out Junglist then - it does stomach churning deep and big body. Does loads of other stuff too.

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Message 23/42 04-Feb-04 @ 01:40 PM - RE: bass vsti

milan

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i cant cause i still wouldnt know what you're after. why not log in and upload a sample of the sound you're trying to emulate? then we'll have a much better idea of what you're talking about.

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Message 24/42 04-Feb-04 @ 05:45 PM Edit: 04-Feb-04 | 05:49 PM - RE: bass vsti

digital rust

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"Digital Rust - how the hell would you know? You don't know the type of tracks
I'm doing and you don't know about the quality levels I'm aspiring too within my
chosen musical style. What a stupid thing to say! Idiot, read my original post."

bro, settle down. i don't know the type of tracks you're after because you never
said shit about them. jesus. i'll elaborate on my first comment so you don't take
this the wrong way.

albino and most of the other VAs that you and others have mentioned here can
all whip out the type of bass you're after. the reason i called out albino is
because it's a sick synth. period. i'd even equate it to a sw virus because of all of
the digital waveforms and modulation possibilities. all i was getting at was that
maybe spending a bit more time learning to program might do some good. you'll
be able to make solid bass on any synth with 2 osc, a filter and an lfo. trust.

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Message 25/42 04-Feb-04 @ 06:22 PM - RE: bass vsti

xoxos

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heard a divers number of styles from d.r. myself over the last going on 6 years :p

my own technique is pretty much entirely synthesised, and a rarely if ever use eq. if you post a demo mp3, i'd be surprised if someone can't patch it on one of the synths you mentioned.

if you're doing house (tho i'm out of date on style) try mda's dx10 (not to be confused with the other dx10 you have to pay for) might also have fun with one of the synthedit freebies using the phase mod osc.

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Message 26/42 04-Feb-04 @ 07:39 PM - RE: bass vsti

Influx

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"heard a divers number of styles from d.r. myself over the last going on 6 years :p"

uh, YEAH!

jory..heres a fuckin valium, man. make it two.

NOW, go learn how to program synths AND learn how to engineer.

k mentioned about eq for the low end, and YOU responded with "yeah, I lower the filter cutoff"

NOT the same.

the idea is to cut some of the LOW out...using high pass EQ or notch EQ.

welcome and all, but if youre gonna fly off the handle that quickly and start calling names, then no, no welcome.

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Message 27/42 04-Feb-04 @ 10:58 PM - RE: bass vsti

BluStudio

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Glad this eq stuff has been brought up-

jory mate, IMHO good and proper eq is the final word on bass sounds, talking about thick and thin bass from vsti's shouldnt be a factor remotely worth mentioning on the subject, and tbh some of the boys answering this thread have got it down cold and doing this stuff for labels/remixes/12's - you could learn from the advice (not meant to be a dig btw)

Actually, whats the seq anyhow (sx?) - can it rewire reason?

I just got my new rig up (G5/PT6/002) and bought reason 2.5 rewired to PT and ive got to say there are some great things going on in there (subtractor/malstrom) - worth a look mebbe?

great thing about running it rewire is you can just use the basic synths and skip the effects/eq and have them from your usual plug sets from your sequencer!

anyhow, not a vsti but when rewired is the same idea and pretty fookin nice (plus those refx ones i said about ^^^ ) Also some good patches floating about to get you a taste of where you want to go/tweak

blu

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Message 28/42 05-Feb-04 @ 12:10 AM - RE: bass vsti

Influx

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theres a good one, too. "everyone" uses rewire, but only a handful use it thoroughly, and running it through a mixer sounds even better!

heh...that would be fun to have a reason box and a solid analog mixer with like 24 channels of DA.

wonder how that would sound

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Message 29/42 05-Feb-04 @ 01:03 AM - RE: bass vsti

Pongoid

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Jory, don't take this the wrong way, but indeed any one of those plugins will give you what you need. However, you may not be able to hear it in the room you are in. You are listening in the nearfield, in a room that may well be defeating all kinds of frequencies just because of phasing issues in the room and your monitors. In many cases it's not the tool, so much as how it's used. If you need a bass to be of a certain flavor then it has to have a certain harmonic content, and fill a certain space in your mix. If your drums are punchy and mid-rangey then the bass has to be deeper or the kicks swallow it up. If your kicks are deep and subby, then the bass has to have more midrange content. Either way, the tone is achieved by the correct filtering and EQ'ing. A fact that you're gonna have to accept is that not every tone is going to fit into every mix, and you're going to have to play around for a bit to find a tone that works. If you have it set in your head that you need a certain tone for the bass, then you're gonna have to start from there, and then rebuild your drum sounds around it. That's just the physics of a mix. Two objects cannot occupy the same space at the same time without interaction. The same holds for energy. Energies of the same form and in the same space WILL interact with each other, especially of the same frequency. Learn it, accept it, and use it. There is no other way.

Ape

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Message 30/42 05-Feb-04 @ 02:26 AM - RE: bass vsti

digital rust

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all really good points, pongoid.

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Message 31/42 05-Feb-04 @ 08:44 AM - RE: bass vsti

dARKSTATe

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Where's he/she gone?!

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Message 32/42 05-Feb-04 @ 10:05 AM - RE: bass vsti

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yeah - what he said - filter cutoff simply adjusts the tone of the sound, what i mean is to cut OUT low frequencies with an inserted hi-pass filter tuned in to 40-60hz ish

BUT - what we REALLY need is for you to simply find an example of the bass you mean (or something very close) and post up a snippet in mp3 as a forum attatchement - that's WHY we added this ability to the forums,
.
why bother trying to descibe something when it's so easy to simply post an example

THEN people can say: "Oh right!... well that is....etc "

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Message 33/42 05-Feb-04 @ 07:15 PM - RE: bass vsti

Influx

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hey pongoid...

I read somewhere..cant remember...a suggestion that "the room" isnt quite as important in nearfield monitoring. I mean, sure...a noisy as fuck room will be a problem, but...bein right up, 3-4' from the monitors, youre getting monitor sound, not room sound, no?

curious about this one.

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Message 34/42 05-Feb-04 @ 07:31 PM - RE: bass vsti

cydonia cell

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Awesome post pongoid! I just got to reading this thread... and obviously the kid has wandered off. (No one likes to be told, "It's a bad worker that blames his tools")... just wanted to say, "Cheers!"... pongoid. I think we all for the most part understand everything you said, but there was a time when we didn't, and it was probably very helpful to the guy, if he read it!

e

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Message 35/42 05-Feb-04 @ 08:44 PM - RE: bass vsti

Pongoid

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While the nearfield is certainly less of an issue for mids and highs, the lows are not made simply immune to the effects of the room, just by proximity. Those frequencies require a lot of energy (electrical-mechanical-kinetic via air) to be audibly perceived. Thus in most cases they have enough energy in them to travel to hard surfaces, like walls, windows, etc. and be reflected back into the nearfield, and interact with the energy therein, unless those surfaces can either absorb that energy, or redirect it in a way that has a destructive effect elsewhere in the room before it can return to the nearfield and interfere/interact with what is supposed to be an accurate reproduction of your listening material. How to reduce those effects? Dampen the room with sound absorbant materials, like foam, sound curtain, acoustic tiling, blankets even. It all adds up.

Ape

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Message 36/42 05-Feb-04 @ 11:32 PM - RE: bass vsti

Influx

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or people. just have lots of people in the room while youre working

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Message 37/42 06-Feb-04 @ 02:33 AM - RE: bass vsti

Pongoid

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yeah, people make great damping material. Piles of dead ones especially, that is if you can put up with the smell, slime, and the flies in their various stages of developement.

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Message 38/42 06-Feb-04 @ 01:36 PM - RE: bass vsti

Jory

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Pongoid, I appreciate your help (you know what yor talking about) but actually I have 3 inch Auralex Studiofoam Wedges coupled with Venus Bass traps. Plus you recommended a Prophet but my original title of this post was Bass VSTi's which I don't think Prophet do, do they? I get the feeling that your all talking to me like I'm some 17 year old kid playing with Reason when actually I'm 3 releases into a record contract with Mantra Records. I think I'm going to have to log on properly and post an example of what I'm after. Thanks K, its properly the way to go.

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Message 39/42 06-Feb-04 @ 03:33 PM - RE: bass vsti

milan

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aye... we tend to treat everybody like scum

so... give us a sample to mangle

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Message 40/42 06-Feb-04 @ 03:43 PM - RE: bass vsti

xoxos

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that's because it sounds like you've got lots of money and toys, but not the most important one: time! i'll take synthedit (free) against any expensive synth if you want a patching contest.

even if some alleged expert says 'not much,' (context.. could be encouraging) oc a room is going to affect nearfield monitoring. try moving 2' if you don't believe it. the important thing with monitoring is not anechoic conditions, but familiarity with your setup.

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Message 41/42 06-Feb-04 @ 05:54 PM - RE: bass vsti

cydonia cell

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There is a prophet vsti plug! It's made by Native ... the Pro-53!

let's hear the sound, man...

e

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Message 42/42 06-Feb-04 @ 05:57 PM - RE: bass vsti

Pongoid

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What was that thing called? The Profive? Pro V? It's a vsti version of a Sequential Circuits Prophet5 with more voices and a couple new features. There's even a version two out with things like delay and maybe a hi-pass in it.

I'm not assuming you're young. Just that you have questions, and I'm trying to answer them with REAL possible solutions. If your wedges are placed correctly and the bass traps are also effective, then it's probably more a case of choosing the right sound than choosing the right instrument. Although some will do better than others, most can get you by. Personally, I kinda gave up on most vsti's trying to do bass, and do it with analog, VA, or a real bass, myself.

Ape

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