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Forums - Synths & synthesis
Subject: desperate...
Original Message Date: 16-Sep-00 @ 06:04 AM - desperate...
Can anyone give me their thoughts on what features the sequencer in a 303 clone should have added / omitted? I know I'm probably really, really pissing people off posting these requests all the time but I would really appreciate suggestions. As you might remember, I started this project bloody months ago and it's about time I got started... Thanks all - Trev
Message 21/58 20-Sep-00 @ 09:13 PM - RE: desperate...
I'll drop in some late seq. ideas.
I like the tr-606 way of changing
length. perhaps have a row of 16
buttons with a led below/above it to
indicate: when holding down
button, the lit LED's
indicate the lenth of the pattern.
I'll just throw another one, when in
pattern play mode, the 303 can
"bunch" patterns in groups of 4. If you
can specify in the "pattern lenth"
section (on my imaginary seq) which
parts you want played, so after the
pattern is writtern, you can only play
steps 1-4 or 5-8 etc. (perhaps a way
to NOT group them in four exists).
Also, if you made a 16 note pattern,
and wanted to shorten it, to say 8, the
other 8 notes would be stored in a
buffer, so you can go back to 16
notes. Also the ability to do this live
would be awesome, I think Robin
Whittle has a mod for the 606 that
lets you punch in/out of other
patterns and stuff.
As for inputting the notes, there can
be a 303 style keyboard with
transpose LED's. Also each key,
including the #'s would have a led.
So say, you press or
something.. you press step <3> (or a
next/back button) then the LED next
to <3> lights up and below a
corresponding note's LED is lit, also
transpose UP / Down 's LED lights
up if applicable.
Hmm, does this sound too much like
rebirth?
back to work, I'll read some more
posts and throw replies later.
909.
I like the tr-606 way of changing
length. perhaps have a row of 16
buttons with a led below/above it to
indicate: when holding down
indicate the lenth of the pattern.
I'll just throw another one, when in
pattern play mode, the 303 can
"bunch" patterns in groups of 4. If you
can specify in the "pattern lenth"
section (on my imaginary seq) which
parts you want played, so after the
pattern is writtern, you can only play
steps 1-4 or 5-8 etc. (perhaps a way
to NOT group them in four exists).
Also, if you made a 16 note pattern,
and wanted to shorten it, to say 8, the
other 8 notes would be stored in a
buffer, so you can go back to 16
notes. Also the ability to do this live
would be awesome, I think Robin
Whittle has a mod for the 606 that
lets you punch in/out of other
patterns and stuff.
As for inputting the notes, there can
be a 303 style keyboard with
transpose LED's. Also each key,
including the #'s would have a led.
So say, you press
something.. you press step <3> (or a
next/back button) then the LED next
to <3> lights up and below a
corresponding note's LED is lit, also
transpose UP / Down 's LED lights
up if applicable.
Hmm, does this sound too much like
rebirth?
back to work, I'll read some more
posts and throw replies later.
909.
Message 22/58 21-Sep-00 @ 04:25 AM - RE: desperate...
Trev, mean the sound won't be 100% accurate compare to a real 303 if you change the time mode programming method. I believe the 303 handles tied notes and sliding ones somewhat differently. So keep the original programming method.
In the software clone I'm writing I combined "both" worlds. That is it only has note on/off and slide. However it will only load a new note from the sequencer if the note is on. Actually I prefer that method over both
Best Regards,
Mike
In the software clone I'm writing I combined "both" worlds. That is it only has note on/off and slide. However it will only load a new note from the sequencer if the note is on. Actually I prefer that method over both
Best Regards,
Mike
Message 23/58 21-Sep-00 @ 12:36 PM - RE: desperate...
The actual method used to enter pattern information (including timing, slides etc) into the sequencer is not actually relevant. The programming method can be anything you like.
What IS important is how the sequencer part actually relays that pattern information to the analogue section. Though the user interface might work a little different to that on the TB303, appropriate slide, accent and pitch control signals sent from the microcontroller to the voice section will be timed just as they are in the original machine. A given pattern will sound just the same on either machine.
There do seem to be differences in the way that Rebirth handles slide information, but this is not specifically due to the way that you program the sequencer. Just hidden 'features'. It does do a few things differently. It does seem to load 'silenced' notes, so that it's possible to slide in or out of a silenced note, if you know what I mean.
Your method of programming your software clone is interesting. The problem I face is that when the user programs pitches, the LED display will show him the current step (just like on Rebirth). Things would get a bit messy if you implemented the 303 way of entering timing information because notes would have to be 'shoved along' if you enter white notes, OR, it would have to ignore note X if note X-1 is tied over to the next step. Not sure if I like this. I might try all sorts of methods and settle on the one I like.
Shit, sorry if this sounds long winded! But if anyone actually understands me (there's a first for everything!) tell me what you think. Thanks again for your input guys.
Trev (anorak mode)
What IS important is how the sequencer part actually relays that pattern information to the analogue section. Though the user interface might work a little different to that on the TB303, appropriate slide, accent and pitch control signals sent from the microcontroller to the voice section will be timed just as they are in the original machine. A given pattern will sound just the same on either machine.
There do seem to be differences in the way that Rebirth handles slide information, but this is not specifically due to the way that you program the sequencer. Just hidden 'features'. It does do a few things differently. It does seem to load 'silenced' notes, so that it's possible to slide in or out of a silenced note, if you know what I mean.
Your method of programming your software clone is interesting. The problem I face is that when the user programs pitches, the LED display will show him the current step (just like on Rebirth). Things would get a bit messy if you implemented the 303 way of entering timing information because notes would have to be 'shoved along' if you enter white notes, OR, it would have to ignore note X if note X-1 is tied over to the next step. Not sure if I like this. I might try all sorts of methods and settle on the one I like.
Shit, sorry if this sounds long winded! But if anyone actually understands me (there's a first for everything!) tell me what you think. Thanks again for your input guys.
Trev (anorak mode)
Message 24/58 21-Sep-00 @ 07:58 PM - RE: desperate...
How about LFO w/ a momentary trigger
like the
Jupiter6........................hey pete
how do i get my mac to stop double
posting and cutting off my sentences w/o
........................................
..................
like the
Jupiter6........................hey pete
how do i get my mac to stop double
posting and cutting off my sentences w/o
........................................
..................
Message 25/58 21-Sep-00 @ 09:58 PM - RE: desperate...
give it rest TREV! your not impressing anyone.
Talk, talk, talk, Where is the machine???
Talk, talk, talk, Where is the machine???
Message 26/58 22-Sep-00 @ 07:35 AM - RE: desperate...
Well for starters I'm not trying to impress anyone. It's called RESEARCH. It's necessary to "talk,talk,talk" to people BEFORE bringing the new product out, so that it meets customers requirements i.e. is what people actually WANT! Otherwise I would run the risk of offering yet another badly researched product, and it flops.
Fortunately, MOST people, bar one or two individuals, have taken the time to provide me with useful input for this project. I am most grateful to them.
As for 'where is the machine', it has taken many, many months so far and is likely to take many months yet. Why? It's called TIME, or lack of it. That stuff that some people seem to have too much of. I'm not even promising to bring the machine it in the end, I might fail, but I'll try very hard.
When...if.. the machine finally comes out, THEN I'll be impressing people. Which is more than you'll achieve by being a complete lemming and posting comments like the one above, er, 'wicket'.
PS LFO is a smart idea. Thanks!
Fortunately, MOST people, bar one or two individuals, have taken the time to provide me with useful input for this project. I am most grateful to them.
As for 'where is the machine', it has taken many, many months so far and is likely to take many months yet. Why? It's called TIME, or lack of it. That stuff that some people seem to have too much of. I'm not even promising to bring the machine it in the end, I might fail, but I'll try very hard.
When...if.. the machine finally comes out, THEN I'll be impressing people. Which is more than you'll achieve by being a complete lemming and posting comments like the one above, er, 'wicket'.
PS LFO is a smart idea. Thanks!
Message 27/58 22-Sep-00 @ 11:48 AM - RE: desperate...
Trev, I'm not exactly sure how the 303's mpu outputs gate information. Try this for example: Enter a pattern of length one with accent on the note. Turn accent up to maximum. According to my data you shouldn't be able to hear any sound between notes.
/Mike
/Mike
Message 28/58 22-Sep-00 @ 07:05 PM - RE: desperate...
Why not just make a total 303 clone with the same buttons, functions, etc? Nothing different, just a 303 straight up. It'd be nice to have one without paying full market price.
-Nick
-Nick
Message 30/58 23-Sep-00 @ 05:23 AM - RE: desperate...
Actually Nick, that's the orgininal intention. The machine will have pretty much the same control layout and the same analogue circuitry. So provided that you don't mind having one without "Roland" on it, you're effectively getting a dirt cheap 303 ;-)
But I think it would be a good idea to update it a little bit, with step/pattern displays to ease programming a bit, proper memory backup, more pattern memory, or anything really that (a) won't change what it is and (b) will not bump up the price too much.
Trev
But I think it would be a good idea to update it a little bit, with step/pattern displays to ease programming a bit, proper memory backup, more pattern memory, or anything really that (a) won't change what it is and (b) will not bump up the price too much.
Trev
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