Forums - Synths & synthesis
Subject: To self - Oscillate..
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Original Message 1/75 29-Oct-00 @ 12:27 AM - To self - Oscillate.. newbie question
Evar
Message 2/75 29-Oct-00 @ 02:38 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 3/75 30-Oct-00 @ 05:03 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 4/75 30-Oct-00 @ 03:30 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 7/75 31-Oct-00 @ 07:32 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
neat yes. but why its such a big deal I never understood
Message 8/75 31-Oct-00 @ 02:08 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 11/75 05-Nov-00 @ 12:50 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 12/75 05-Nov-00 @ 01:29 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
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Message 13/75 05-Nov-00 @ 02:57 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 14/75 05-Nov-00 @ 07:13 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
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Message 15/75 05-Nov-00 @ 08:24 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
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Message 16/75 05-Nov-00 @ 08:48 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
The self oscillation sound is what people talk about when they ask if a synth's filter self-oscillate. That's why people say, for example, TB-303's filter self oscillates. One can never not feed any signal into an unmodified TB-303's filter. And that's why some people care if a synth they are buying has self oscillating filters. They care about the how the filters behave for their created sounds, not that wheter the filters oscillate or not if they don't feed any signal in that synth.
Message 17/75 06-Nov-00 @ 12:33 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 18/75 06-Nov-00 @ 09:03 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 19/75 06-Nov-00 @ 10:10 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 20/75 07-Nov-00 @ 03:59 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 21/75 07-Nov-00 @ 01:01 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
ashley
Message 22/75 07-Nov-00 @ 11:28 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 23/75 07-Nov-00 @ 11:28 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
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Message 24/75 08-Nov-00 @ 01:59 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Resoance - A function on a filter in which a narrow band of frequencies (the resonance peak) becomes relatively more prominet. If the resonant peak is high enough, the filter will begin to oscillate, producing an audio output even even in the absense of input.
Most VAs in the market right now are mostly just DSP synths. They don't do any real physical modeling of existing analog filters. There are so many ways to get the same results in DSP. You never know if the most convincing self oscillating DSP filter you ever heard actually just crossfade addition sine wave to the output when the resonance is turned up.
Message 25/75 08-Nov-00 @ 12:06 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
happens at around 121-124 on the microwave, anything past then and most osc sounds are completely drowned out.
Message 26/75 09-Nov-00 @ 02:51 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
oscillation only happens when NO sound is
coming into the filter. You cited nearly every
VA out there as being self oscillating, and
you "must insist" that your right. Well, fine,
but you're not. I own a Virus and a Jp-8000
and can assure you that neither of them self
oscillate, nor do most VA's. For an example
of what self oscillation means, listen to a
microwave, or an sh-101.
Then crawl back here and humbly admit that
you got told, succka =)
Message 27/75 09-Nov-00 @ 02:52 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
oscillation only happens when NO sound is
coming into the filter. You cited nearly every
VA out there as being self oscillating, and
you "must insist" that your right. Well, fine,
but you're not. I own a Virus and a Jp-8000
and can assure you that neither of them self
oscillate, nor do most VA's. For an example
of what self oscillation means, listen to a
microwave, or an sh-101.
Then crawl back here and humbly admit that
you got told, succka =)
Message 28/75 09-Nov-00 @ 02:53 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
oscillation only happens when NO sound is
coming into the filter. You cited nearly every
VA out there as being self oscillating, and
you "must insist" that your right. Well, fine,
but you're not. I own a Virus and a Jp-8000
and can assure you that neither of them self
oscillate, nor do most VA's. For an example
of what self oscillation means, listen to a
microwave, or an sh-101.
Then crawl back here and humbly admit that
you got told, succka =)
Message 29/75 09-Nov-00 @ 03:47 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
oscillation only happens when NO sound is
coming into the filter. You cited nearly every
VA out there as being self oscillating, and
you "must insist" that your right. Well, fine,
but you're not. I own a Virus and a Jp-8000
and can assure you that neither of them self
oscillate, nor do most VA's. For an example
of what self oscillation means, listen to a
microwave, or an sh-101.
Then crawl back here and humbly admit that
you got told, succka =)
Message 31/75 09-Nov-00 @ 06:38 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
-;) i think 4 is a new record.succka succka succka succka. sucka only has 1 c you managed 8.
Message 32/75 09-Nov-00 @ 11:16 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 33/75 09-Nov-00 @ 05:16 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 34/75 09-Nov-00 @ 07:24 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 35/75 09-Nov-00 @ 07:27 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Ape
Message 36/75 09-Nov-00 @ 08:32 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
this and any future posts doubling(or
quadrupling), I'm gonna write K and
see if it's cause I have a mac or
whatnot.
Music-DSP mailing list? Theres your
problem. Digital goon. Self
oscillation (key word "self"), means
that when all oscillator volumes are
off, the filter alone can produce a
sine wave. The JP can't do that. The
virus can't do that. The nord can
kinda pretend to but not really.
Anyway, shut up and get a real synth,
ditch your "DSP" list for an analog
list, then come back and talk child.
As H said above, an example of self
oscillation is the deep kicks you can
get from say a 101 or 202, using
nothing but a self-oscillating filter
and an envelope. Anyone that has
both analog and VA can tell you that a
VA trying to do that next to an analog
is downright silly. Back me up H.
Now go buy a 101, they're cheap, and
their educational value for
digi-people is incredible.
Peace
Message 37/75 10-Nov-00 @ 01:03 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
nothingnowhere, well, try a filter module of a moog modular. you don't have to connect it to anything at all. no signal in, no noise. but it will still self oscillate.
the nord modular filter module was programmed to do the exact same thing here too.
Message 38/75 10-Nov-00 @ 01:45 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
have their place, and I'd be at a loss
without them or analogs. I was
simply correcting your mistake. You
explain how you think a VA like a
virus self oscillates and I'll kiss your
mother.
P.S Moog filter modules, as with
nearly all moog modules, have a
barely to non-audible hum that
creeps it's way into the signal path.
In fact, nearly all old modulars
do.This is how moog filters self
oscillate with nothing attached. And
stop getting so fucking defensive.
This was an intelligent conversation
untill you went and called me
"ignorant" for knowing more than you
do.......
Message 39/75 10-Nov-00 @ 01:07 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Hum is bad, but yes normal. That's what noise gates are for.
Make beats.
Ape
Message 40/75 10-Nov-00 @ 03:30 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
DSP synths can self-oscillate (The Supernova can for sure).
Like Ape says, it's a pointless act to wank over the definition of the term. Make music.
-Craig
Message 41/75 10-Nov-00 @ 09:49 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
said, MOST dsp synths can't. Try it on a JP.
And seriously, if you don't want to
perpetuate a topic, then don't add to it, and
at least read what you're replying to. Christ,
I would've forgotten this thread existed by
now....
And now I will. Over and out.
Message 43/75 11-Nov-00 @ 08:44 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
And once again GOODBYE.
Message 44/75 11-Nov-00 @ 09:35 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 45/75 11-Nov-00 @ 11:23 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 46/75 12-Nov-00 @ 07:38 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
fucking dropped it, regardless of the
fact that everyone else here knows I
was right, because I DON"T
FUCKING CARE!!!! Is being right
about the definition of self oscillation
THAT FUCKING IMPORTANT TO
YOU?!?!? God, I guess you couldn't
expect much more from someone
who calls himself Boomer.......well,
whine and squeal all you want you
little troll, go try and spoil someone
elses day now.
Message 47/75 12-Nov-00 @ 12:47 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
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Message 48/75 12-Nov-00 @ 01:02 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
what i was trying to tell you was that don't ever try
to tell others to do mature things when u cant do it
yourself. we are all the creatures of ego here. The
proof is clear, we come to this board to confirm
our egos everyday.
nothingnowhere, I am aware of the inherit noise in
analog signal path. But you mean even the tiniest bit of noise
that no one can hear can set it off? Well I doubt it. If it's so,
how come some analog filters don't self-oscillate and those
seem to be the worse and noiser kind.
Message 49/75 12-Nov-00 @ 05:09 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Peace-Evar
Message 50/75 12-Nov-00 @ 08:56 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
bolivian team, eh?
Message 51/75 12-Nov-00 @ 10:29 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 52/75 12-Nov-00 @ 11:41 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 53/75 12-Nov-00 @ 11:43 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 54/75 13-Nov-00 @ 12:54 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Just thanking everyone for the information . Rather than discuss it forever I just wanted anyone who is self oscillating with a virus successfully to share how they are doing it. If it can't be done then C'est la Vie (that's life).Thanx for your input also!
Evar
Message 55/75 13-Nov-00 @ 02:52 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
EVERYONE who got caught up in this, get out your dictionary and look up PEDANTIC.
then look in the mirror and repeat over and over again, while looking DIRECTLY into your own eyes:
PEDANTIC PEDANTIC PEDANTIC PEDANTIC
then go home.
discuss less, do more. no?
Message 56/75 13-Nov-00 @ 11:06 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Evar, so what does self oscillate mean to u? If it means like I understand (it's just the sound, not the matter of having the signal passing thru the filter or not), then I can show you that.
Message 57/75 13-Nov-00 @ 01:49 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Ape
Message 59/75 13-Nov-00 @ 10:15 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 60/75 13-Nov-00 @ 11:25 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 61/75 14-Nov-00 @ 12:03 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 62/75 14-Nov-00 @ 02:25 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
all volumes=full
goooooodby speakers.
Message 63/75 14-Nov-00 @ 05:18 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 65/75 16-Nov-00 @ 11:23 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
all the way down and noise set to zero?
How!?!?!? I'm one of three people I know
who have one and none can do that. even
with the noise set to 1 it's weak as hell and
the noise can still be heard. What is it that
you're doing differently?
Message 66/75 17-Nov-00 @ 06:46 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 67/75 19-Nov-00 @ 06:15 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
if it can make the sine, then it is oscilating, with no input, it is SELF-oscilating...
...self...
think about it
Message 68/75 19-Nov-00 @ 06:56 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
-Craig
Message 69/75 20-Nov-00 @ 01:51 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Rewrite this phrase in less than two words.
"the sound that sounds like a sine wave when resonance is turned up high"
Message 70/75 20-Nov-00 @ 07:19 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
I`m disappointed in myself that I even got involved.
Message 71/75 21-Nov-00 @ 01:10 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
- j
Message 72/75 21-Nov-00 @ 09:43 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
high and rude like? But okay, I'll do what
you said:
Rewrite this phrase in less than two words.
"the sound that sounds like a sine wave
when resonance is turned up high"
Okay. OSCILLATING. Now, if you tack on
"with no signal going through", then it is
SELF-oscillating. Something a virus cannot
do.
~Kevyn
Message 73/75 21-Nov-00 @ 10:01 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
Message 74/75 24-Nov-00 @ 02:18 AM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
pedantic
Message 75/75 28-Nov-00 @ 04:26 PM - RE: To self - Oscillate..
when you have a stack of cans, all it takes is one from the bottom to make the whole stack fall right? there's no 0s in the real world....
wanna try it out? try this experiment on your mixer (it probably needs to be an analog mixer, dunno...it DOES need EQ)....i usually do this through effects, it's fun with a lot of reverb....run the output of the effect into an input on your mixer, and an aux send to that effect. now, turn up the aux send on that channel (yes, feedback, i'm sure we've all done this before by accident) until it feeds back...then back off just a little bit until it stops feeding back.
now, take the mid EQ and turn it up just until it starts feeding back again. now, sweep the mid frequency, and watch the sound follow the knob. just like a self-oscillating filter. even more fun if you have something else in
the mix, something else feeding to the effect too (drum loops are fun).
personally, i find the whole thing boring....you know, if you take a 45Hz square wave, and filter it down, you get a sine wave too right? the "advantage" of self-osc, like someone mentioned, is not that it self-oscs,
but that you can get very close without going over, and it sounds good there.
(and many synths that don't have pitch envs, will have filter envs...with self-osc, instant pitch-env). anyway just a little lesson for the day....
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