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Subject: is a pentium 450 enough?

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Original Message 1/43 18-Nov-01 @ 10:27 AM - is a pentium 450 enough?

bster

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My pc is shit and i have been offered a 450 pentium with 500mb of ram and a 2 gig hard drive, i now i'll have to get a bigger hard drive and a sound card but will the 450 proccesor be enough for hard drive recording and editing of my sounds from my Supernova,JX-10,DX-100? (i'm not going to use any plug ins.
any help thanked
jaime

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Message 2/43 18-Nov-01 @ 06:18 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

bedwyr

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in a word, yes. a 450 is quite capable of runnning some plugins too.

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Message 3/43 19-Nov-01 @ 01:53 AM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

Bit Crusher

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I run a k6-2 400 which is notorious for not having enough floating point power. Its enough for midi and a few plugins though. You can use as many plugs as you want as long as they are processed offline. I can get at least 10 tracks of audio with a few plugins. Id take it!

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Message 4/43 19-Nov-01 @ 03:22 AM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

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NO - I have a p3/450 and my 700 duron TOTALY slays it.. and i mean totaly. Go for an 800 and you'll get 3-4 times the amount of plugins than the p3/450 and way faster processing of files when editing etc, & they cost peanuts.

___________________________________

I had an idea for a script once. It's basically Jaws except when the guys in the boat are going after Jaws, they look around and there's an even bigger Jaws. The guys have to team up with Jaws to get Bigger Jaws.... I call it... Big Jaws!!!

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Message 5/43 19-Nov-01 @ 09:23 AM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

bster

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K when you say an 800 do you mean a Pentium, Celeron or an AMD?

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Message 6/43 19-Nov-01 @ 04:15 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

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duron 800 or a duron 1000 even - i'm saying 'duron' as opposed to athalon due to the price range infered by him asking about a p3/450 which implies a cheap solution - if you are looking at the cheap end of the market, forget pentium/intel, durons are tokaly smokin'!!!

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Message 7/43 19-Nov-01 @ 04:42 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

bedwyr

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bster, depends on how much your paying for this 450. if it's free or near enough, then maybe you can keep the box, monitor, graphics card etc. buy a new mobo, hd, processor, memory and be laughing. a mate just priced a athlon 1ghz with an 80g hd and one of those lurvly flat screens that k has got, all for �750 uk. nice! (onbard soundcard though, not for a music head ... still)

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Message 8/43 19-Nov-01 @ 05:24 PM Edit: 19-Nov-01 | 05:26 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

dARKSTATe

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'Nother frame of reference for ya.. I put my 1.4GHz Athlon, 512MBDDR, 64MB GeForce2Titanium, 2x40GB HDD, 40xCD, 40x16x10CDRW (Just the box only mind, already had a monitor, keys, mouse etc) together for �650... (Yep, even at "rip-off-Britain" prices if yer prepared to do a little leg work and build the thing yerself..)

Marc_D

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Message 9/43 19-Nov-01 @ 06:47 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

bster

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I've only got �400, but i've got a monitor/mouse/keyboard and usb card, i dont know how much my mate wants for the 450 system yet but i'll get a 20 plus gig h/d and a cheap pro s-card like an echo mia to go with it. i might sell my JX-10 as it doesnt sound to good (in my opinion) and i havnt got the pg800 controller.

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Message 10/43 20-Nov-01 @ 09:12 AM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

dARKSTATe

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Does the �400 include you buying the soundcard??

Coz �400 will get you quite a bit of *NEW* PC, if you've already got the monitor and bitz'n'pieces!!

The thing is, it doesn't always pay to mix'n'match new components on old systems.. for example, all the new harddrives are ATA100 ready, but when used on an older system thats only ATA33 you're losing a lot of the benefit of the newer technology... the same goes for memory as well...

Just take a little time out to think about it... if I can put together a much newer machine for �200 more, then you should be able to put together a decent machine with your budget..

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Message 11/43 20-Nov-01 @ 12:09 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

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no way 400 quid!!!... forget it... if you have a pc already then you have the bitz you neeed (keyboard, mouse, screen, cdrom & windows. you need: case, (�35) board & cpu & fankit, (120-150) ram (�30-60), fast ata100 drive (�100 quid) & cheap agp graphic's card (�30 quid)

assuming you have already a decent audio device & your s/w, then the stuff above is cheap.

a new fast duron can be had for 350 quid total if you got the rest of the 'odds & ends' bits & screen etc. But that machine will run loads of stuff it'll do a complete backing track in s/w with ease and allows stacks of fx and plugins..

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Message 12/43 20-Nov-01 @ 03:58 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

dARKSTATe

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Erm.. crossed wires methinks..

That's what I was tryin' to say...

If I can put together a 1.4G (Athlon, not Duron) box with a few extra trimmings (i.e. Towercase & extra fans, a slightly better specced gfx card, not necessary I know but.., 2 HDDs, CDRW & CDRom, etc.) for around �650..

..then of course you'll be able to put together a slightly lower specced box for less...

(These extras DO add up though but that's what I wanted - i.e. A 1.4Athlon as opposed to a cheaper Duron, a �90 gfx card instead of a �35 quid one.. and I know they're not necessary for the music requirements K outlined.. I'm just laying a spec down for comparative purposes..)

Marc_D

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Message 13/43 21-Nov-01 @ 11:15 AM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

bster

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cheers for the advice.

I'll probably look at building my own from scratch or buy a new pc from pcworld/etc without all the shit(printers,speakers,scanners, etc) and then upgrade the ram and buy a second HD.

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Message 14/43 21-Nov-01 @ 12:07 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

dARKSTATe

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Noooooooooo don't buy from PCworld (not even sure you can buy a barebones system from them without all the bundled shite anyhow)

If you (know how/are confident) to build your own box, just go shopping online at somewhere like

http://www.overclockers.co.uk

(Got my parts from them, quite well priced)

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Message 15/43 21-Nov-01 @ 03:13 PM Edit: 21-Nov-01 | 03:55 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

bedwyr

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yup got my bits from there too, good quick service. just do a list of parts you want and start shopping around, & and ask lots of questions before you buy! scariest bit for me was putting the processor fan on my athlon, thought i was gonna slip and crack the mobo. there's a site that compares prices automatic too

there you go - link above

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Message 16/43 21-Nov-01 @ 03:59 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

dARKSTATe

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Dude told me one "safer" way was to use your poking device for pushing the fan clips down from *inside & between* the fan blades reducing the chance of slipping...

Worked fine for me (both times!) - had to remove the CPU/FAN from my first new mobo coz the 2nd mem slot blew for some reason, only letting me have a paltry 256MB RAM (pathetic!)

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Message 17/43 21-Nov-01 @ 04:16 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

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i second that - FUCK PC WORLD!!... never ever... and they sell the two worst pc brands in the world.

use your local PC-Fair... cheapest, refundable in person for faults either by visiting their home-address or by taking the goods back the following week - i always shop there, they even take plastic & the gear is just as reliable as from a big chain.

I would say with ram so cheap start with 256mb -

In one box by the way i've got a Seagate 'U Series' ata drive... VERY quiet drive... super quiet, they are easily idetifiable because they are encased in like a black rubber sock which is slipped over the drive shell, covering it's edges and corners... very quiet drive indeed, even with the case cover off it is almost inaudible in use.

I can't remember if it goes to ata100 tho cos the p3/450 it's fitted into doesnt go that high, but it's got the ata ribbon cable with it and wont run without it. Anyways, they are definately worth looking at!

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Message 18/43 22-Nov-01 @ 02:28 AM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

Brett B

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my pIII 800 is maxing out before i can finish my tracks. Go with a 1.2 athalon if you plan on using 24 bit. 16 bit is no comparison to 24bit. They are dirt cheap now. I am building a dual 1.2 athalon with windows 2000advanced server to take advantage of full multi-threading. Lower latency uses more CPU as well. Go all out on your pc, don't let cpu starve your creativity.

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Message 19/43 22-Nov-01 @ 03:07 AM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

influx

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a PIII 800 isnt cutting it? youre doing something wrong, man

I just dont understand this!! all the shit that most people here would call "dope" was written on way less impressive machines

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Message 20/43 22-Nov-01 @ 09:15 AM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

dARKSTATe

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All in the mix Influx buddy..

Depends what this guy was doin', his working methodology... bit of a dicey one to debate coz ppl work in different ways..

Of course you can put together a fantastic track on a PC capable of running orion and a couple of VSTIs.. but if he's using his PC to mix the parts a 30 piece orchestral arrangement...

I suppose you've gotta know what the person is trying to achieve/what kit they're running before its possible to make an assessment on whether the computer setup their using is up to the task or not..

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Message 21/43 22-Nov-01 @ 09:15 AM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

bster

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I've been on to pcindex and have been looking at an Athlon 1.3 (�90)Asus a7m (113)Quantum fireball plus 7200 (90)

do i need a 32mb graphics card or will a 16 do also i couldnt workout what type of memory the Asus mobo takes any one got any ideas.

cheers for the info everyone.

Bster

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Message 22/43 22-Nov-01 @ 11:26 AM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

dARKSTATe

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Check out www.overclockers.co.uk...

Go to their motherboards page, look up the same mobo you're intending to get, it should have a bit more detail on the type of ram slots there...

You don't even need a 32MB gfx card if its just for music production.. 8MB will be plenty enough to drive your monitor in a high enough resolution at a decent colour depth..

Marc_D

(of course, if you wanna play games too.. ;)

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Message 23/43 22-Nov-01 @ 02:50 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

bedwyr

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aaarrrgh! games!!? fking things cause all sorts of problems, put them on a seperate install of windows if you must indulge. ;)

try www.crucial.com for your memory, just input your mobo and it finds the right memory for you, and get as much as you can coz it really does make a difference, get a 512 stick and you can just keep buying more later till your full

mmm ... memory

ps don't forget to price for an os as well, unless you can 'borrow' one

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Message 24/43 22-Nov-01 @ 04:38 PM Edit: 22-Nov-01 | 04:39 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

dARKSTATe

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Yep... and think about gettin' a "Cpu manufacturer approved fan"... sounds a bit anal to do so but I've heard enough horror stories about ppl not using fans correctly specced to their cpu and hence not getting enough cooling and pffft....

Cost me about �65 for 512MB of DDR Registered RAM (the unregistered stuff is a touch cheaper, not tecchie enough to know what the diff. is, but as it was only a little saving I went for the more expensive stuff) in 2x256MB sticks..

And Bedwyr.. ain't nothin' wrong with the odd game here or there if you got 'em not interfering with your system - except when all those loverly MAME Roms stop you from doing work (3.2GBs worth.. sheesh! ahem...!)

"Go retro.. go retro.."

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Message 25/43 14-Dec-01 @ 08:42 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

Brett B

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50 tracks at 24/48khz, plenty of waves REQ's, RCLS's, GRMTools Filters,Automation out the ass, from pans to fx sends. The music I do is complex with many string sections layered and mixed with tons of rynthm tracks. I give each drum part it's own track ,eq, and compressor if needed, kick and snare. I'll let you have a listen the song I am working on now that has maxed my out my 800. The fact is, that as your ability to write and peform sound production grow, you will need the extra power. I can do most of my tech-house songs ok with the 800, but some of the more"hybrid" like break beat tracks are to complex for my machine. I have five stereo string tracks, all the drums,synth and atmospheric stuff,I still need to add the vocals, and My machine is stuterring hard. Many of these tracks are full lenth, not clips. I have already bounced down most of the fx, and converted the project to 16 bit. But I need my new computer to take it to where it can go. I'll post it for you Influx when it's done.

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Message 26/43 14-Dec-01 @ 09:36 PM Edit: 15-Dec-01 | 12:01 AM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

influx

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whats it take you, a year to write something? and your "tech-house" can usually work on an 800? my man...

like I said, youre overdoing it

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Message 27/43 15-Dec-01 @ 10:22 AM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

xoxos

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no, influx, the fact is if you have more and better gear, it means you're better. like huh i know some fool who's been using one analog synth and a freaking 8 track tape machine (ergo seven tracks really) and her's been doing it for eighteen years! what a sucker, eh, you think their ability to write and peform sound production would grow by now huh.

the funny thing is that some people have been actually buying recordings of this for several albums now, even following when they change their project name. see they just don't know when they're listening to someone who doesn't have the ability to write and perform sound production because they don't need extra powerr

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Message 28/43 15-Dec-01 @ 07:49 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

influx

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hehe. It just seems that expectations rise exponentially...

hey Brett..have you looked at the UAD-1 card? something you should have a look at

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Message 29/43 16-Dec-01 @ 07:38 AM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

Brett B

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yes , but i love Sonar, and the uad-1 is only vst pc. I sent them numerouse e-mails, and even requested that Sonar contact them. None of the dsp cards are DX. plus, that card is as much as a new machine.

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Message 30/43 16-Dec-01 @ 09:39 AM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

influx

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yeah, $30k worth of sound for $600. seems fair to me.

but the driver thing. guess that could be a problem. hadnt thought about that one. bummer

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Message 31/43 16-Dec-01 @ 06:51 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

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well that new egosys driver looks interesting for sonar doesnt it?

___________________________________

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Message 32/43 17-Dec-01 @ 09:33 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

Brett B

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yeah K, I posted that up on the Sonar thread. Their cards look like the Sonar winner to me, but having xtra dsp power from an additional card like the uad-1 would be nice but not for $1000. They selling for $600 now? I am happy with my Waves Gold bundle. I just need more cpu to take advantage of the new Renaissance reverb. Most of my cpu is eaten up by my plug-ins. I use many instances of the Renaissance Compressor. Filters like GRM, PI Warp, Fromage. They all eat up resources. I also only have a 100mhz system bus, not the 133. it makes a noticable diferance.

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Message 33/43 17-Dec-01 @ 10:13 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

influx

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but thats my point! the UA is DSP so..you dont need more processor

I have a shop that will sell me one for $580 shipped. Probably do a bit better for TWO then!

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Message 34/43 17-Dec-01 @ 10:13 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

influx

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but thats my point! the UA is DSP so..you dont need more processor

I have a shop that will sell me one for $580 shipped. Probably do a bit better for TWO then!

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Message 35/43 18-Dec-01 @ 05:40 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

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yeah, but is the egosys dsp reverb any good?... their built in fx might be crapola...

damn it, why doesnt someone release dsp cards to load standard VST & DX plugs ?>.. by now you'd think SOMEONE would have got that out... there is one company but you have to use their plugins only.

___________________________________

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Message 36/43 18-Dec-01 @ 06:58 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

steve

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I think sensoniq was saying pulsars been tweaked to allow its onboard dsp to be used to power vst plugs now but the implementation is shite with awful latency or sumfing.

Don`t it seem as if dsp cards might be dead before they`ve even got started tho? I can`t see it being too long before you can knock up a pc with dual 2.2ghz processors and a lightning fast system buss very cheaply so would we really need these things then?

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Message 37/43 18-Dec-01 @ 08:14 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

knowa

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I second K's "damn it." I don't know enough about computers to judge how difficult this would be, but some sort of general VST plug accelerator would be a miracle. I guess companies are banking on sick, multi GHZ machines in the near future, but I bet that even then, apps will be redesigned to make use of the additional power and we'll still be wanting more. that's why some sort of universal VST card would be so dope--no matter what machine you have and what plugs you use, it will boost your performance. I guess that at some point, the difference between fast and slow machines will be less critical than it is now. Waves and NI are the best companies IMO, and they are both sort of anti-DSP I think.

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Message 38/43 21-Dec-01 @ 09:02 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

Brett B

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hell, you can build a tower with two 2ghz PIV's for under $2000. Then you don't need dsp card fx. But as we move to 192khz audio for dvd audio and SACD, these new superfast machines will be working as hard as my current running 44.1. K , I am not getting the egosys dsp based card. I am getting an audio teminal 010 . It's digital only with a midi port-tdif/adat/r-bus and spdif. I have always thought it would be possible for a hardware developers to make a pci card that handled native fx or at least versions of the plugs for hardware. That is what protools , tc- powercore, emu rx32,uad-1 are doing. They just seem to have ignored DX8 as a consumer level format, not a profesional format. Sonar is young and developers will see that cakewalk is truely huge. I think within the next two years we will see harware based fx systms for dx8. For now, I am just going to build a dual cpu system.

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Message 39/43 22-Dec-01 @ 03:05 AM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

Brett B

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Got the new tune up-"shadows and Dust"

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Message 40/43 22-Dec-01 @ 05:31 AM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

influx

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I listened. am listening again. I guess I didnt get the hint when you drop all those comments about hybrid that you would sound like em.

hehe. cant say that I hear 40-50 tracks in there

cant say its all bad, either. some cool sounds. a bit long, no? oh..progressive breaks. I forgot. long.

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Message 41/43 22-Dec-01 @ 05:41 AM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

influx

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gotta say that I like Desolation better. I cant lie and say Im into the progressive thing (hehe...some people I know call it breaks for girls;)) but its a cool sounding track, man.

reminds me a lot of mindspawns dance stuff. ever checked that out?

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Message 42/43 22-Dec-01 @ 07:57 AM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

Brett B

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well it is 48 channels going. Most of the tracks are stereo, so two tracks per sound. Only the bass and kick are mono. You also can't really here the highs or the strings, or even the backing drums at 24kbs mono. I may post a shorter higher bit depth clip.

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Message 43/43 22-Dec-01 @ 11:25 PM - RE: is a pentium 450 enough?

Brett B

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I put up a 64kbs clip for you to hear the backing tracks better.

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