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Forums - The lounge
Subject: september 11th
Viewing all 188 messages - View by pages of 10: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 ... 19
Message 4/188 11-Sep-02 @ 09:22 PM - RE: september 11th
from the 411 perspective, people in new york have improved manner.
ya know, i chat on this christian music site.. lots of teens.. i like to abdu.. err.. familiarise myself with their perspective..
it pretty much sapped my will to contribute when i saw one of them posting about how he saw the president and was all like 'gee, he's swell..' then another one goes, 'i saw him too, he's a nice man..'
anyone out/up there can do anythnig to make a difference? please, wipe out all the bad and stupid people now.. xoxos needs you.. now..
Message 5/188 11-Sep-02 @ 09:27 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 7/188 11-Sep-02 @ 10:31 PM - RE: september 11th
every fecking website I like has someone that feels the need to play the role that the media are FLOGGING TO DEATH quite nicely.
TV is off today.
hey..gb is a nice guy for sure! and he has the vision and clarity to recognize EVIL when he looks in the mirror...I mean...sees it before him
Message 8/188 11-Sep-02 @ 10:38 PM - RE: september 11th
My heart goes out to anyone who lost someone that day.
Message 9/188 11-Sep-02 @ 10:55 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 10/188 11-Sep-02 @ 11:04 PM Edit: 11-Sep-02 | 11:06 PM - RE: september 11th
he is NOT MY FUCKING PRESIDENT and if you or anyone tries to tell me again that he has my/our best interest in mind I will find myself experiencing an overwhelming desire to punch them in the nose.
what happened a year ago was horrifying but what has happened since was a hundred times worse.
Message 11/188 11-Sep-02 @ 11:07 PM - Re: september 11th
This partial chronology of U.S. intervention in the Middle East illustrates the lengths to which the U.S. power structure has gone to gain and maintain U.S. domination of the Middle East--a
region considered key to the U.S.'s standing as an imperialist world power. This is not a complete list of the invasions, bombings, assassinations, coups and other interventions by the U.S.
government, its allies, or its client states, nor does it fully document the U.S.'s economic domination and exploitation of the region's people and resources.
Message 12/188 11-Sep-02 @ 11:11 PM - RE: september 11th
think about it for just one second?
your protector is doing his best to remove all freedom...and most of the people like you are going along with it!
Message 13/188 11-Sep-02 @ 11:14 PM Edit: 11-Sep-02 | 11:15 PM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
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The choice is always the same, revenge or compassion .. until people on all sides start choosing the latter then this moronic carnage will continue...
Message 14/188 11-Sep-02 @ 11:19 PM - RE: september 11th
I cant help but wonder what is with these people and the people who believe in them?!?!?!
Message 15/188 11-Sep-02 @ 11:20 PM - RE: september 11th
how to deal with it." my plan was hole up
somewhere and make some highly polished
turds with some expensive audio equipment.
and you?
Message 16/188 11-Sep-02 @ 11:44 PM - RE: september 11th
when you figure out how to polish turds let us know ok?
Message 17/188 11-Sep-02 @ 11:52 PM - RE: september 11th
every death is a tragedy, but judging from mainstream media an american death is 1000 times more tragic than the death of anyone else. and of course this pisses everyone off. and the fact that america is now using 9/11 as a pretext to go arresting, invading, killing anywhere they fu*king please.
america went to the middle east a long time ago, but of course not too many americans know much about it.
i was in NYC in January this year and it broke my heart to see letters written by kids, posted on a memorial in grand central station, asking if anyone had seen their dad. it sounds like there's going to be a lot kids in baghdad soon who'll be asking what happened to their parents.
bush is very, very scary.
Message 18/188 12-Sep-02 @ 12:15 AM - RE: september 11th
pictures of me that day sitar?
and influx is right - are you saying Americans
were wrong to oust the British monarchy then?
They were YOUR leaders after all Brett.......
oh, and Tony Blair's a robot. Be afraid.
Message 20/188 12-Sep-02 @ 12:51 AM - RE: september 11th
psylichon
Message 21/188 12-Sep-02 @ 01:11 AM - RE: september 11th
anyway...it really is sad what happened, and it DID happen today, so today is an appropriate day to commemorate
but..that slideshow...it said something about it being done so that we dont forget why we're fighting?
blech!
Message 22/188 12-Sep-02 @ 01:13 AM Edit: 12-Sep-02 | 01:15 AM - RE: september 11th
pict
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Message 23/188 12-Sep-02 @ 03:03 AM - RE: september 11th
if things continue the way they are going you will be a muslim country with no freedom of religion. my friend in leeds tells me now they are turning churches into mosques because no one in britain bothers with church anymore. you can bet the mosques are full tho.
don't say it can't happen because it is happening under your very noses.
there are peaceful ways to convert countries to muslim (out breed the locals) and there are overtly hostile ways to convert countries to muslim.
anyone remember reading the history books? this stuff has all played out before.
i am not talking about crusades or even the reformation.
i am talking about religion joined with government...
if you think that *any* of the muslim nations don't want to put the entire world under their thumb then you are turning a blind eye.
thats the big picture and while it may not affect any one of us this decade it *will* be a defining role in the future of our children and their children.
i may not like the xoxos religion (he has a cult following now btw :-) jk... but i am *very* glad he is allowed to have his religion.
i hope it stays that way forever...
now you guys can rant all about how its the oil etc... but its more about the way of life we have in this country and even the right for people like influx to make political comments like he does and not get thrown into prison.
there are two huge areas of the world that will *flatten* western culture any chance they get.... one is china and the other is the muslim world.
thats a whole lotta people hating not only the US but the EU and all the other free nations of the world.
are we going to war? i dunno. i am powerless to stop it. but at least wait and hear the reasons if we do go to war.
GB means nothing. you people would be doing the same whining crap if gore was in office so stop to consider whats at stake instead of the fact you don't like the guy in office.
jamey
Message 24/188 12-Sep-02 @ 03:07 AM - RE: september 11th
^
Message 25/188 12-Sep-02 @ 04:02 AM - RE: september 11th
Message 27/188 12-Sep-02 @ 04:52 AM - RE: september 11th
How many of ours died?
How many of "theirs" died...whoever "they" might be?
How many of those were "innocent casualties"?
When the hell are people going to get it through their thick fucking PC squeamish little pin-head skulls that soldiers are not the only people to die in war, never have been, and never will be?
How has the media helped put confidence back into the economy?
How has business been since the towers tumbled?
Who HAS done well since then?
Where did the 40 billion dollars without a receipt go?
How is our intelligence community doing?
Did we get the "bad guy" and all his flunkies?
Do you feel any safer?
Is flying a more secure mode of transportation now?
How are other forms of transport doing these days?
Have rail prices dropped?
Are we doing anything to improve transportation, using resources that don't rely so much on Middle Eastern interests?
Are we developing technologies that make us safer or just pry into the general public's private lives?
How has the Music industry been doing?
How are record distributors doing?
How about it for live gigs? More or less than before a year ago?
Where did folks take the wrong turns and the right ones, and how can we either undo, or move on from the damage and get to doing productive things that will improve all our lives and keep events like this from happening in both directions?
Muslims and Chinese want everybody under their thumbs?
Are we (US) a better alternative?
Can we be (all) better?
What would the world be like without our (US) influence or presence?
What are the alternatives?
These I think are topics for reflection on this day. I hope that they help to inspire you to make our world better. Peace all, everywhere.
Ape
Message 28/188 12-Sep-02 @ 08:52 AM - RE: september 11th
"and being a native of New York, I am a little disappointed by the attitude with which so many of you responed to this and our president. there is a war coming, you should figure out how to deal with it.... with anger and hostility to your own countrymen, by being snide jackasses with nothing but negativity to those trying to solve the problem facing us, or doing what is necassary to keep us strong as a nation. The problem in the middle east has come to us, now we will go to it and try and end it, if not subdue it for as long as posible. I don;t think we will ever be safe from terrorism, but we will never be oblivious to it again. Preemptive measures need to exercised. And tust they will be. Let's see what congress has to say!"
Message 29/188 12-Sep-02 @ 08:53 AM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
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mmmmm, yes of course we are... what can we possibly do to prevent that.. they are trying to outbreed us and will eventually convert all the christians.. what to do eh?
I know!
1) Remove their right to religious freedom
2) Invade them and impose our political system.
After all, we dont want to live in a world where people aren't allowed freedom of religion and the right to be determine their own future... excellent plan!
Message 30/188 12-Sep-02 @ 09:21 AM - RE: september 11th
Yes, we should get rid of Saddam. But what's afer that? If *we* are not prepered to share the power, the wealth of the earth and the air we breathe with the people in the M.E. the only other option is extermination. Total extermination. And remember that neither side will go 'down' without dragging a substantial part of the other down with them.
Message 31/188 12-Sep-02 @ 10:05 AM - RE: september 11th
Bench, "an american death is 1000 times more tragic than the death of anyone else.". I dont think we can really nail down the exchange rate here. IF we had some numbers from a gloriously non US celebrated non US tragedy then we could have oranges and oranges but I don't know of any (benefit of public - 'the lightbulb has to want to change') Anyway realty - if it is just a numbers game (I suppose back to the excuses and diversion model)
Formant "there are peaceful ways to convert countries to muslim (out breed the locals) " - So froging what. Are you a dynasty to protect the future for some line or 'us' even. As far as religeon goes what is capitalism to the rich? sustainability anyone?
USMC - the machine just sits there. Its value (outside of cold war brinkmanship) is questionable without a war (except for flexing egos and opponents opinion). This and out of date munitions suggest that accountants could justify it - in which case (as pongoid mentions) what (and who's) is the benefit.
Leaders speak to leaders - do they listen..?
What to do. Buy 'eastern' products (till they are bought over;)
Message 32/188 12-Sep-02 @ 10:21 AM - RE: september 11th
Allende was the leader of a reformist government that opposed US intervention and activly attempted to forge an independent nation. This contradicted with US "interests" in the region. So they got rid of him.
...and they wonder why they have enemies?
Message 33/188 12-Sep-02 @ 11:02 AM - RE: september 11th
damn. I rememeber hearing about that shit somewhere
FUCK THE US GOVERNMENT
there. I said it. Cant wait til the assholes in suits come to my door.
god damn power monger humanity hating JOCKS
Message 34/188 12-Sep-02 @ 12:22 PM - RE: september 11th
*war, war, war*
come and get your customised war! our highly skilled technicians are prepared to give you the war you want, at competitive rates!
aah, why bother. ya don't fucking have a clue, do you.
Message 38/188 12-Sep-02 @ 01:26 PM - RE: september 11th
yah i know that is definately the case.
religion bonded to nations/states is a really bad thing. it exists in china (communism is a religion) and it exists everywhere there are fundementalist islamic states.
its just as arrogant to think that the status quo will remain as it is to be an american.
jamey
Message 39/188 12-Sep-02 @ 01:49 PM - RE: september 11th
BeeJayTee
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Message 40/188 12-Sep-02 @ 01:53 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 41/188 12-Sep-02 @ 01:57 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 42/188 12-Sep-02 @ 02:14 PM - RE: september 11th
Well why don't you invade China? Because they'd ing wipe you out overnight, that's why! Why don't they invade you if they want to take over the world? Simple answer : they don't want to because they're not paranoid about what you're thinking of doing to them. Don't wind each other up with foreign policy and you can peacefully co-exist for ever no matter how divergent your world views or large your weapons of mass destruction.
America are wrong diddly wrong wrong in the Middle East but they can't really pull out now after all they've done and said.
Message 43/188 12-Sep-02 @ 02:30 PM - RE: september 11th
It's getting weirder. i think the oil interests are way too big for it to ever change. Unless people give up petrol guzzling monsters.
What ever happened to Kamen's Segway?
Message 44/188 12-Sep-02 @ 02:33 PM - RE: september 11th
Do I win £5 ?
Message 45/188 12-Sep-02 @ 04:38 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 46/188 12-Sep-02 @ 05:50 PM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
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Sadaam had nothing to do with 9/11 anyway.. what's the connection?
Why don't the UK and the US just come right out and say 'we want control of the oil' and we are prepared to kill to get it, instead of all this bullshit 'Iraq doesnt do what the UN tells it to'.. well, neither does Israel or any other number of countries!
Yes, Sadaam is an evil dictator who represses his own people... but he sure ain't the only one.. and there are a lot of those very dictators that the US supports with money and weapons etc. Want a list?
Message 47/188 12-Sep-02 @ 06:20 PM - RE: september 11th
___________________________________
I had an idea for a script once. It's basically Jaws except when the guys in the boat are going after Jaws, they look around and there's an even bigger Jaws. The guys have to team up with Jaws to get Bigger Jaws.... I call it... Big Jaws!!!
Message 49/188 12-Sep-02 @ 09:58 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 50/188 12-Sep-02 @ 10:48 PM - RE: september 11th
espoo2
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Now as far as us needing to go with Iraq... That's ridiculous. Once we do that, it makes US the rogue nation, because everyone else in the world is opposed to it and they KNOW we have ulterior motives... (ie, oil, revenge for daddy, etc). Furthermore, there is NO PROOF that Iraq has any kind of WMD.
NO PROOF.
NO PROOF. Understand? So we are going to go to war for something that the entire world is opposed to, backed up on Bush and Cheney's "hunch".
It's absolutely revolting. Let's go kill a bunch brownie's who hate our dad! Woohoo!
Brett: Get a clue. The cable news channel is not your friend. Read a book. Think for yourself. Lot's of the country is actually trying this new thing, this "thinking for yourself" thing. That's why the polls are pretty much split down the middle as far as "lets kill some brownies" v. "what a stupid president we have". The rest of the world, who aren't quite as dependant on television as we are, are trying it as well.
Want some more opposition? What about the lead arms inspector during the inspections? He is completely against war. He says that there is no way that Iraq is any way capable of having WMD or nukes. Go to www.msnbc.com for the video.
Jesus Christ. Allah. Buddha. Flying Invisible Elves. Whatever.
I wish people would get off these ridiculous religious crutches and think rationally for once. Then we wouldn't have morons flying planes into buildings for THEIR little invisible flying elves in the sky, and we wouldn't have Bush and his cronies sending missles at other people for an excuse to get more oil, look tough, avenge daddy, and defend HIS little green elves in the sky.
Message 51/188 12-Sep-02 @ 10:59 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 52/188 13-Sep-02 @ 12:03 AM - RE: september 11th
psylichon
Message 53/188 13-Sep-02 @ 12:03 AM - RE: september 11th
pict
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Message 54/188 13-Sep-02 @ 12:28 AM - RE: september 11th
me naked is repulsive sitar.
*sulks*
Message 55/188 13-Sep-02 @ 09:26 AM - RE: september 11th
JAWA
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What's wrong with China and communism? Okay well communism has some problems in practise, but it's not a totally bad idea.... Everybody equal and all that. But China's a great place, of awesome beauty. Have you ever been there? Didn't think so.
I think your friend in Leeds is a twat. hahahaha Muslims are taking over the country oh dear. I'll tell you why nobody over here goes to church, no-one goes to church because it cold and boring. If church was fun then people would go, it's not about God it's about the community feeling and having a laugh, people like to feel part of something. And english churches are crappy, run down and cold.
The thing that narrow minded idiots all seem to do when they talk about Islamic religion is they have no idea what it's about. You cannot categorise Muslims with fundamentalists. They are a small group of nutters who take it all too literally, and give everybody else a bad name.
Just like you cannot compare football fans to football hooligans, a small group of nutters who ruin it all for the rest of us.
Or let's look at dance music as an example, you hate generic labels as much as the rest of us, how would you like to be labeled in the same category with Country music? You'd hate it. Again a small bunch of nutter ruining it for the rest of us :-)
But it's all music man, it's all the same stuff? isn't it? ring any bells? it's all Islam, it's all communism......
And it isn't as if Christianity hasn't had these problems with nutters too you know, and oh guess what? it still has.
Religions are actually all on about the same things. Live and let live, treat other people how you want to be treated and don't be a c**t.
JAWA
Message 56/188 13-Sep-02 @ 12:04 PM - RE: september 11th
BeelaalaaJT
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Message 57/188 13-Sep-02 @ 12:43 PM - RE: september 11th
So is this scary possibility reason enough for the annihilation of possibly tens of thousands, if not more? Do you kick the dog on the end of the block, just because he was woofing late at night, nipped you once while you were kicking him for barking before, and you THINK he might have bigger teeth in his mouth now?
Again, the big question comes to mind...Who profits through these actions?
Ape
Message 58/188 13-Sep-02 @ 12:55 PM - RE: september 11th
If we are talking delivery systems then I think that they have already done the job - Kebab shops guys, those little shops springing up everywhere. Stuck away in the back corner behind the packs of poly bags is a special section of the wall, which, if you press the right way opens a panel where "THE DEVICE" sits. In the larger places the wall opens to a walk in room for training, subversion, chatting etc, and is linked by subterranean passages to strategically important places such as govermental office, key ministerial misteresses bedrooms the lamb butchers - I am sure you get the point.
Its OK though cos in every McDonalds is...
Message 59/188 13-Sep-02 @ 01:01 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 60/188 13-Sep-02 @ 01:08 PM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
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1944: U.S. State Department memo refers to Middle Eastern oil as "a stupendous source of strategic power, and one of the greatest material prizes in world history." During U.S.-British negotiations over the control of Middle Eastern oil, President Roosevelt sketches out a map of the Middle East and tells the British Ambassador, "Persian oil is yours. We share the oil of Iraq and Kuwait. As for Saudi Arabian oil, it's ours." On August 8, 1944, the Anglo-American Petroleum Agreement is signed, splitting Middle Eastern oil between the U.S. and Britain.
Message 61/188 13-Sep-02 @ 02:28 PM - RE: september 11th
if church wasn't stupid maybe people would go.
(sorry f)
Message 62/188 13-Sep-02 @ 02:29 PM - RE: september 11th
JAWA
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I'm not sure if Turkey would be too happy about being asociated with international terrorism
Message 63/188 13-Sep-02 @ 02:36 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 64/188 13-Sep-02 @ 02:38 PM - RE: september 11th
If the people didn't need crutches the church wouldn't exist
PS - Economisting Zazza?
Message 65/188 13-Sep-02 @ 02:59 PM - RE: september 11th
turkey is about the only one i can think of...
its not because islam is bad blah blah whatever its because the fundementalists of islam end up controlling popular thought and regiems of government.
let me ask a very simple question.
once the population of britain reaches 50% muslim (1 decade, 2? who knows) what mechanisms are in place to keep the government intact?
the same goes for any country that allows 'religious freedom'... what is keeping religous freedom laws intact? its the will of the people in those countries.
china has NO religous freedom. people are killed there every single day of the year for having a belief system outside what the communist party allows.
sudan, malaysia, etc same story. people who choose not to follow islam are killed.
once your population hits 50% (or whatever is needed for legislative change in your particular country) you will see a change happen.
we aren't that far removed from all this stuff.
people didn't have freedom of religion in the 1500s... you were whatever religion your country said you were or you were KILLED....
the muslim world has world conquest in mind (peacefully for some, violently for others) but you can be sure they will not tolerate religious freedom in any place where they can oust it.
i am not worried about the 'peaceful' muslims that cnn interviews. i work with them and know they are not out to get me. we have good conversations about religion and such. they obviously are not fundmentalists. but how far away is any religious person from becoming fundementalist when the right situation presents itself??????
i am worried more about the fastest growing religion in the world and how in nearly every single instance that a country becomes muslim, all other religious freedoms are banished.
jamey
Message 66/188 13-Sep-02 @ 04:13 PM - RE: september 11th
JAWA
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Jamey, i do not know you personally but you are sounding like an idiot, look at what you have just written.
You are taking a narrow minded view point that just because a country is run by a small bunch of nutters, the whole country is like that.
That would be like me saying just because Bush is in power in america (is he really though??) then every American is an oil loving tosser who thinks that the health of the environment is everybody elses problem. Exactly, it's a narrow minded view.
Jamey do you know how many people there are in China? Do you honestly think they are all Western hating communists?
The truth is your average person does not give a s**t. That is why these losers get voted in and try and take over the world. That explains Bush's election as much as anybody elses.
China is a beautiful place full of beautiful people, you've never been there and you're calling them all repressing communists I LOVE IT hahaha.
JAWA
Message 67/188 13-Sep-02 @ 04:24 PM - RE: september 11th
___________________________________
I had an idea for a script once. It's basically Jaws except when the guys in the boat are going after Jaws, they look around and there's an even bigger Jaws. The guys have to team up with Jaws to get Bigger Jaws.... I call it... Big Jaws!!!
Message 68/188 13-Sep-02 @ 04:24 PM - RE: september 11th
JAWA
Posts: 1
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You reckon they're all gonna want to repress us?
Christ's sake!!! Muslims are good people on the whole, just like you and me, you get good people and bad people everywhere. That's life, deal with it.
Truth is the baddies don't always go around stroking a white cat and "evil music" showing they are bad guys.
The bad guys here are on all sides, where none want to understand the other.
America is f**ked, their economy is shot, they are suppossed to be the ritchest nation yet they have a national debt that is going up 1.1 million dollars a second. The only sure fire way to help this is to go to war and have oh look lots of arms sales. Same in the UK too.
JAWA
Message 69/188 13-Sep-02 @ 04:27 PM Edit: 13-Sep-02 | 04:28 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 70/188 13-Sep-02 @ 04:33 PM - RE: september 11th
I think maybe you should ask yourself this question, Jamey
Message 71/188 13-Sep-02 @ 05:03 PM - RE: september 11th
typical DT one-way looking glass "hey, i tow the popular line" way to thinking
some of you are sooo foolish to think that a muslim run government is going to be smooth as a baby's ass - taahhaaa - afghanistan bring ANYTHING to mind?? okay, how about SUDAN??? the list goes on and on -all over the world.
if you listen to the muslims on video tape, they say they want a muslim run world - THEIR words - "...and we want to take over the world" - THAT is from some fat assed, intolerant recruiting these crack pots from london! oh well, england will always be mastered by someone other then her own
from what i've seen in the media news, muslims are intolerant to the nth-degree, especially to God's people of Israel. many muslims find it easy to hate, full stop.
"live in denial, become captive"
Message 72/188 13-Sep-02 @ 05:23 PM - RE: september 11th
JAWA
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Exactly, the media, what you have seen in the media. What about for your own eyes? Or is it too much like hard work actually getting to know people from other areas of the world?
Message 73/188 13-Sep-02 @ 05:29 PM - RE: september 11th
"if you listen to the muslims on video tape, they say they want a muslim run world"
gt, you sound like a twat. which muslims, what tape? for fucks sake listen to yourselves.
"some of my best friends are twats." .. ummm, maybe not.
Message 74/188 13-Sep-02 @ 05:30 PM - RE: september 11th
i do ask myself that question, often...
i don't view the populations of china and sudan etc as bad or evil people.
i view the people in power as that way. you can't generalize about mass population but you can look at the actions of governments and dictators and see the fruit of thier views.
its obvious that no one here sees religious freedom (even the freedom not to have a religion) as something that is in jeoprody when over half the worlds population does not enjoy the basic right to practice the religion of thier choice.
i think that history has born out that religious freedom is a fleeting thing.
under the romans, if you didn't follow thier religion you were thrown to the lions
under the middle ages (whether christian or muslim) you were unable to choose your religion.
even in the 1500s your religion was whatever the state told you.
one of the things that makes america a great place to live is that it was founded on the idea of religious freedom. anyone in this country can practice the religion they choose or none at all.
that is one value that i *do not* see islamic and communist states upholding.
jamey
Message 75/188 13-Sep-02 @ 05:38 PM Edit: 13-Sep-02 | 05:39 PM - RE: september 11th
anyone for a quick war? winner takes oil.
Message 76/188 13-Sep-02 @ 05:50 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 77/188 13-Sep-02 @ 05:55 PM - RE: september 11th
That's why all the currency says "in God we trust"
Message 78/188 13-Sep-02 @ 06:15 PM - RE: september 11th
look in the mirror Jamey, you are clearly a religious person and the right situation appears to be presenting itself!
The saber rattling of GT, Formant and Brett stinks to me... fine upstanding community of protestant christians with well manicured lawns and young jock kids. Then a latino family moves in. They're catholic, due to their very close sense of family their children are more open... less controlled! They enjoy having family members over, and often leave windows and doors open! This frightens the locals... "There goes the neighborhood! They're going to end our comfortable way of life with their different WAYS!" RACISM!!! Just because it's a tired word doesn't mean it's invalid!
When the Irish catholics began populating America in the early part of this century Americans thought they would ruin the American way of life. "Soon we'll all be catholic, cabbage eaters.." and what-not. "They'll out breed us"... (I'll bet one of the 3 of you has Irish blood!)...
Your reasoning and logic is steeped in a fear designed by those you call your leaders. Terrorism works as a form of population control. A democraticaly elected government with an agenda other than that of it's people must manufacture fear and derision to achieve it's ends... The Nazi party was democraticaly elected and found a scapegoat in the Jew for it's embarrasingly bad behaviour! (Oh, there he goes with the Nazi's again!)
I'll say it: If our government wasn't complicit in the WTC attack it WAS tolerant! If you put it past these self serving, f*ckheads you're blind!!! "America's gone to hell in a handbasket... legal abortion, welfare, an administration ELECTED on the notion of socialized medicine (big Clinton platform in 92)... We've got to take drastic measures to bring this country back to the values we HOLD DEAR!... steal an election (Dare 'em to stop us!) Orchestrate a major attack on US soil... ratchet up law enforcement and the military, steal back our oil interests and reset this country on the course we held through the 40's 50's 60's... boom times for america!"
Tony Blair is a pod person! The real Tony Blair has been closeted and silenced... SAD!
If you're afraid of your freedoms being taken away by Muslims, then I suggest you keep a KEEN eye on the wrinkly old white Mother F+ckers in positions of power in the US... they're stealing more and more every day!
e
Message 79/188 13-Sep-02 @ 07:27 PM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
Posts: 1502
Link?: No link
File?: No file
I suggest you take a look at the actions of the UK and the US and their creation, support, funding and arming of dictators in that area and apply that logic. Then you might understand why the middle east is in such a mess.
Lets just be upfront about this, it is NOT about democracy or human rights, it is about oil and power, always has been, always will be.
The reason the US and the UK always stand together is simple.. its anglo solidarity, the same reason that the UK, Canada, Australia always share intelligence. It's just the white folks making sure they stay rich.. and the rest of the world can go f**k themelves unless they get in their way, in which case they'll get help f**king themelves.
If you don't believe me then please go search the internet for histories of US and UK involvement in the world since the 2nd world war.
Personally I am totally pissed off with my tax money being spent murdering, destablising, asassinating, arming and generally f**king people over.
If you are stupid enough to believe that the current policies being put forward by the UK/US are designed to protect freedom and democracy then you need your head examined... DONT'T believe these liars..
Just do a tiny amount of research...
Remeber when a little kuwaiti girl was paraded in front of the media claiming that she had witnessed iraqis removing babies rom incubators and leaving them to die on the cold hospital floor? Turns out she was the daughter of the Kuwaiti ambassador and had never been anywhere near Kuwait hospital! She had been coached and rehearsed by Hill & Knowlton (PR Agency) for her appearance before the Congressional Committee. This was run all over TV in the west and quoted by Bush senior many times as an example of why Sadaam was like 'Hitler'. Shame it was a complete lie eh?
Get real, these guys will tell you that the Iraqis are killing their own children by not spending money to feed them to justify the infant death rate of 6000 a month. The same way the japanese told their people that americans ate babies.. it is ALL LIES!
They will tell you anything they think will whip you up into a state where you will glady sacrifice your sons and daughters for their ends.
If you fall for this bullshit, more fool you.
Read your history!
If you want to read about the Kuwaiti baby lie and many others check these links:
Christian Science Monitor
Wake up people, they are playing you like a violin.
Message 80/188 13-Sep-02 @ 07:33 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 82/188 13-Sep-02 @ 08:11 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 83/188 13-Sep-02 @ 08:25 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 84/188 13-Sep-02 @ 08:39 PM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
Posts: 1502
Link?: No link
File?: No file
Message 85/188 13-Sep-02 @ 09:09 PM - RE: september 11th
so you have discerned my skin color (white?) and religous preference (protestant?) and the fact that i am racist (no likey hispanics) simply from my postings here. you do the same thing you accuse me of...
its obvious from this thread that religious freedom means nothing to most of the people here.
the part of the western world that has religous freedom now has only had it for 300 years or so.... do you really think that it cannot be taken away? since recorded civilization began state has been married to religion, we actually manage to get rid of that for a few mere centuries and now it can never go back to the way it was.
right.
jamey
Message 86/188 13-Sep-02 @ 09:42 PM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
Posts: 1502
Link?: No link
File?: No file
hmm?
Message 87/188 13-Sep-02 @ 10:09 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 88/188 13-Sep-02 @ 10:16 PM - RE: september 11th
The willful demonizing of an entire people is racist! "They're sending all of "them" here to take over our country"... listen to yourself!!!
e
Message 89/188 13-Sep-02 @ 10:25 PM - RE: september 11th
some of my best friends are *biggots*.
Message 90/188 13-Sep-02 @ 10:27 PM - RE: september 11th
and people are killed EVERY FUCKING OTHER PLACE IN THE WORLD for not complying with american whim.
dunno..Jamey and GT...Im sorry you guys but you are about as right wing as it gets...and the funny thing is...youre CHRISTIANS and the fundamental belief that you hold (and DONT try to tell me this isnt true) is that YOUR beliefs are the only acceptable ones
if it came down to it, folks...you and yours are the ones who would desire absolute compliance...and if it came down to war? yes...you would fight and kill non christians simply for being non christian
the atrocities perpetrated by christians far outweigh the combined efforts of all other radicals..no?
man it gets me riled up to see the level of ignorance you guys display, all the while calling everyone else fools and morons.
Message 91/188 13-Sep-02 @ 10:32 PM - RE: september 11th
errata...no, its not. Im sorry but Im getting tired of the way the concept of racism gets thrown around so lightly.
If I say I dont like the mexis that moved into the neighborhood because they leave burned out cars on their lawn, trash strewn about, etc...its NOT because theyre mexi and its NOT because I think Im better than them based on race.
it might be classist..and honestly I dont see anything wrong with expecting a certain level of decorum and (in this example) maintenance.
I and many others would feel the same way were the mexis 'white trash', black, yellow, purple, etc...
I see what youre saying...sweeping generalizations no bueno...and both GT and Formant are so clearly off the mark sometimes (Ive read bits of wisdom from both, though) and this time...but it's not racist!
Message 92/188 13-Sep-02 @ 10:40 PM - RE: september 11th
in your example Influx I'm hearing that the frustration is with their actions... (burned out cars, etc...) and not that their mexican. Which is valid, but you could have used the same analogy with out ever saying "mexi's" and it would have held up. That's why I would agree that your analogy isn't racist.
The point these guys (and the guy in particular that I responded to) are trying to make, is racist in my view. I hear their point as: "they" are sending "them" here to change "us"... It's not the actions though. It's the PEOPLE... because I seriously doubt if AS A PEOPLE any islamic group in Jameys community is bent on doing the things he's accusing them of. He's generalizing an ENTIRE race based on his ignorant perception of it's people, that's not classism, not cultureism, it's raceism when "they" are islamic arabs! I don't see where this ISN"T racist!
sorry
e
Message 93/188 13-Sep-02 @ 10:42 PM - RE: september 11th
[image file]
ures/attack.jpg">
Message 94/188 13-Sep-02 @ 10:46 PM - RE: september 11th
J and GT...might be racist (the pure definition of racism is a belief that YOURS is superior to others based simply on 'race' (which I really dont believe in anyway...)
and..the 'mexis' thing...NOT a derogatory intent..not at ALL.
Message 96/188 13-Sep-02 @ 11:02 PM - RE: september 11th
must be a mac thing ...
Message 98/188 13-Sep-02 @ 11:08 PM - RE: september 11th
[image file]
yeah, they made us take netscape off all the
macs at work and IE's flaky logged in, and you
gotta log in to use html and post pix, etc.
anyway, this guy at this link has taken a bunch
of WWII propaganda posters and "updated"
them.
Message 99/188 13-Sep-02 @ 11:10 PM - RE: september 11th
argh. it really is time for revolution
Message 100/188 13-Sep-02 @ 11:24 PM - RE: september 11th
That's why I quantified with Islamic Arab... but you're right there as well. I'm sure christian Arabs do not frighten this bunch, so I stand corrected.
I should have stuck with Bigot... but it's so TIRED!!!
hehehe
e
Message 101/188 13-Sep-02 @ 11:56 PM - RE: september 11th
I think of archie bunker...
dunno..the bottom line is...the system that is in power to protect and provide has lost sight of its initial purpose and is overstepping its bounds into realms that ought to be left untouched by government.
"I love my country but I fear my government"
Message 102/188 13-Sep-02 @ 11:59 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 103/188 14-Sep-02 @ 12:14 AM Edit: 14-Sep-02 | 12:15 AM - RE: september 11th
Message 104/188 14-Sep-02 @ 12:38 AM Edit: 14-Sep-02 | 12:41 AM - RE: september 11th
nail/head thing
Message 105/188 14-Sep-02 @ 01:07 AM - RE: september 11th
I hear a lot of bitching on all sides, and not a lot of thought put into viable alternatives. I mean really viable. People talk of things like revolution, and getting people out of office one way or another, and even replacing or massively modifying the infrastructural systems of politics, philosophy/consciousness and even ecology that we have...but then what? What's actually going to work here? Just keeping the same system in place with new faces in it, and trying to unfuck the pregnant-with-planethopper beast that humanity has become with new legislation and PR?? Planetwide neo-tribalism in a post-catastrophic landscape, trying to sort of start over with less people and a better developed sense of mass-mind, less ecological impact, with more focus on responsibilities and consequences for each action, personal and mass? Maybe. Maybe we're talking about trying to repopulate a cinder, from moonstock.
Folks on this planet better get it figured out pretty quick that we've gotta start worrying about bigger problems than what each of us calls the almighty, or it won't matter a bit. The day is coming closer.
No ideas on the Talbot. *shrugs*
Ape
Message 106/188 14-Sep-02 @ 10:16 AM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
Posts: 1502
Link?: No link
File?: No file
indeed a double-edged sword. It both emboldens the blood, just as it narrows the mind.... And when the drums of war
have reached a fever pitch and the blood boils with hate and the mind has closed, the leader will have no need in seizing
the rights of the citizenry. Rather, the citizenry, infused with fear and blinded with patriotism, will offer up all of their
rights unto the leader, and gladly so. How do I know? For this is what I have done. And I am Caesar."
William Shakespeare
Message 107/188 14-Sep-02 @ 12:37 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 108/188 14-Sep-02 @ 02:43 PM - RE: september 11th
nowadays, if you want a drive somewhere, you want a truck. this means that you are willing to compromise the well being of animals and insects that encounter your windshield/tires/bumper for your own interests.
this alone will guarantee that you are not capable of harmonious peace, since it is thus natural for you to consider others interests as discardable if-needs-must. the very concept of vehicular travel equates to brutality. and as it has been said, 'cause kills at will.' remove the cause, you remove the kill. but.. you're all so easily spurred into ambition..
unfortunately, short of a global/cultural disaster, the only way forward is going to be through the distribution of fantastic nondestructive energy sources, since most people want what exists. i'm sorry, but that's the way it is.
the most secure route to making this planet any sort of decent place to live is through increased realisation, and the way humans are wiring each other down to make them realise intersupport systems (ie. to realise what a non-self perspective wishes them to realise) it's not going to happen. there will be no realisation while commercial interests in media endure.
for those who read my page on confluence on the old azstarnet site (not there anymore) this is the foundation.. without foundation of experiential realisation, there can be no theorem for enactment of considerate being. no con-science.
if everyone would just take lsd for a year! just one year!!
Message 111/188 14-Sep-02 @ 08:26 PM Edit: 14-Sep-02 | 08:27 PM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
Posts: 1502
Link?: No link
File?: No file
Seems the natural world operates on a 'needs must' basis...
Of course we could kill ourselves but then that would kill all our parasites too..
Sounds like you are on a buddhist vibe there xoxos...
Have we declared war on buddhists yet?
Message 112/188 14-Sep-02 @ 11:27 PM - RE: september 11th
not religious, but if you're kinky, i my experience lends credence to a beforelife.. the after.. i sincerely doubt most people are capable of surviving life.. they can't make those transitions.. "british we are, british we stay.." et c.
Message 113/188 15-Sep-02 @ 12:27 AM - RE: september 11th
Message 114/188 15-Sep-02 @ 01:06 AM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
Posts: 1502
Link?: No link
File?: No file
Message 115/188 15-Sep-02 @ 01:07 AM Edit: 15-Sep-02 | 01:14 AM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
Posts: 1502
Link?: No link
File?: No file
Message 116/188 15-Sep-02 @ 01:13 AM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
Posts: 1502
Link?: No link
File?: No file
'Bad gig man?'
'Yeah man, they crucified me, Im going back to carpentry...'
Hey, did u know that the reason the romans fed the christians to the lions was that they were conscientious objector and refused to join the army?
Ah, the good old days... when men were men and commandments were commandments
Message 131/188 15-Sep-02 @ 09:09 AM - RE: september 11th
sadly it's now 4am and i made the mistake of reading it.
first of all, brett... i have no words.
i don't even want to get into what's wrong with "doing
what is necassary to keep us strong as a nation"
etc.etc.etc. ad nauseum. it just makes me depressed to
think about you.
secondly, i'm glad that not EVERYONE in the US has
been reduced to a frothing mass of blind haters.
seriously... all that "homeland security" shit really gives
me the creeps. and that spy-on-your-neighbors shit...
you guys need to do something about that FAST.
like, maybe some non-US history would help? i'd like to
beleive that anyone familiar enough with WWII-era
nazi germany would be able to rise above the bullshit.
what would happen if EVERY non-US country officially
decided to oppose the "war on terrorism"? what would
the US do? could they still keep up the good-guy crap
when they're taking on the entire world? cause right
now that looks like the only thing (total anti-US
solidarity) that could help. not that it would ever
happen. still... it would be so nice to see some REAL
justice.
anyway... very tired, sorry for the senselessness...
raigan
Message 132/188 15-Sep-02 @ 10:30 AM - RE: september 11th
Message 133/188 15-Sep-02 @ 11:53 AM - RE: september 11th
But what I REALLY like the best about DT forums is the way it has a built in functionality that makes sure the forums is never populated by a bunch of right wing wannabe intellectual idiots like most other 'tech' forums on the www...
notice the way the right wingers here have been exposed by this thread?... what a laugh.
also some of it is frightening.... we are rational people here aren't we?... not hero-worshipping kids with some distorted reality of the 'music-biz'... and we are all involved in this scenario which is building in the world by the default of living where we do .... it's VERY important to everyone, and it's amazing how some people seem to think that discussing this is some aberration and that we are supposed to all just carry on like good blind little sheep discussing the latest roland boxes etc while our 'good' politicians run tings to disaster and turn ALL OF US into the most hated people on the planet!!!!
Guys ... lets get something straight here... this is OUR generations 'Cuban missile crisis' - this is not a game here.
If you REALLY think that with all this going on people can just ignore it and carry on having banal discussions about reverb units etc then fine...
Now yes, I'm aware how some forums crush debate on the www, banning any OT discussion, and that is all part of the problem - we now have this wonderful www for human communication and the first thing that happens is.... free discussion is banned on it???
Now yes it is true that in the 90's corporates took over the dance industry, and it turned into some geek sponsored circus like the football industry...
BUT, the majority of people doing this shit, running the core of the scene going back to it's roots, is the squat/free festival etc underground crowd, and that tends to dwell in a left-wing, socialist thinking, multi-cultural-accpting scene where the people gravitate toward this type of anti-corporate, left-wing, free-beleif, culturaly-tolerant politic....
C'mon here and THINK about it.... from the early days of the 'rave' scene, or the traveller/free festie/protest scene... from the early days of Glastonbury when it was run free by a bunch of happy helpful volunteers like my cousin who lives in a caravan and has been helping out for free up at the farmhouse since the 70's... before the mean fiddler group & the 'TV station rights' & 'record company new-band promotions' took it over... or mebbe choose the Goa free party scene, bringing back all that eastern influence to the music etc... even the early days of Ibiza was just a bunch of arty/hippies setting up some free/cheap raves a few people used to go out to attend and have a laugh.... Wherever you look from 'rave' to trance, from hip-hop to acid, this whole thing was started and run and progressed by left-wing, anti-govt, underground people, living in poverty/squats/estates etc on the whole who just were doing things. Early scene was held in places like the YMCA or the local youth club throwdowns, squatted dole-offices or other disused gov't buildings or warehouses or factories, putting on NOT ONLY esoteric newly-forming underground dance nights, but free art exibitions, poetry nights, bands, dance classes, all sorts of things... Forget all your yuppie ing warehouse sattchi sponsored galleries announced with a fanfare as some groundbreaking idea... they just stole the whole idea from places like the cool-tan or the Gin factory etc where you could go and see great art exibitions long before the yuppies stole the idea and 'corporatised' it...
Some forget that 'dance' finaly became like the new fashion in the 90's... some forget that suddenly the booze and cellphone companies etc took it over and flogged it into the masses while at the same time the corporate owned gov't still spent it's time utilising resources to crush the activities of the people who actualy started it all and keep it all going as they had always done from the word go... Don't you remember how our government faced with the hysteria of the original evil 'rave' scene (after the hysteria of the evil punk-scene) passed a law to make it illegal for more than 5 people to get together in any premises without persmission from the gov't? - this is STILL law and technicaly it is illegal and you can be arrested if you and some mates get together for a few beers & spliffs and to play some music or chat etc.. FACT... but they reserved the power of this Act to crush 'raves'...
Also you have things like the gov't wanting to include stuff like GM protest under the act of 'terrorism'... all where you look it is the nasty right wingers hiding behind their intolerance and hatred and self assumption of the god given right to tell everyone else how to ing live, running around passing laws to crush anything they cant control...
and as a matter of fact most of the people in the founding rave/techno/whatever groups/bands ALL mostly came from the punk/indie scene, the previously 'banned/legislated against' & officialy gov't branded 'evil' scene...
So dont be surprised to see this type of discussion OR to see that right-wing kids have infiltrated the scene....
I can guarantee this tho.. MOST of the activity STILL happening on a ground level, all the little eclectic 'nights' happening in bars & warehouses etc round the world is STILL run by those people while the little right winger wannabe's sit at home jerking-off over some new pre-amp in a music-tech mag that they beleive will finaly get them that elusive record-deal so they can be 'famous', and otherwise just whining about stuff.
Don't forget where DANCETECH came from... this is NOT some glossy money-launched corporate owned site for flogging corporate tat & philosophy, to turn kids into some blind obedient consumers of crap.... This site started as a litle homepage to tell people that they can get a studio together & go out and play gigs with a some chreap s/h gear...
This site was setup and started as a little set of pages to help people NOT to be conned into thinking they had to buy the latest 'dance-branded' kit to make music... to show newbies that they dont have to be conned to beleive they MUST buy 2 grand pre-amps to get a 'good' vocal sound, or buy expensive 'studio-monitors' to mix with etc... I'm sick of seeing poor kids getting conned by wankers in music shops into buying shit they dont need when they could be out playing gigs and making tunes & having fun with the right advice.
Now... do something!!!!!!!!!
get involved!... start some night in your area, put on bands or new local DJ's, start a local music newletter, start a venue, just ing do something to contribute and stop your whinging and tantrum throwing and chucking the rattle out of the pram all the time.
'Every real prayer has a physical action'
the rest is just talking...
Message 134/188 15-Sep-02 @ 12:34 PM - RE: september 11th
in all hopes, sometimes it can be the best thing you can do.. musicians are communicators, and sharing ideas with communicators is like a highly concentrated form of communication.
Message 135/188 15-Sep-02 @ 09:25 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 136/188 15-Sep-02 @ 09:32 PM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
Posts: 1502
Link?: No link
File?: No file
Message 137/188 15-Sep-02 @ 10:17 PM - RE: september 11th
take over the whole freaking web, man. gawd, i could eat me some bad people like smarties or goldfish or something.
Message 138/188 16-Sep-02 @ 12:10 AM - RE: september 11th
Message 139/188 16-Sep-02 @ 02:27 AM - RE: september 11th
i also think its funny how anyone "right" is morally and intellectually inferior to those not so inclined.
but does anyone read what i write or do they see the name 'formant' and their mind immediately brings up all the stereotypes and connotations that they have associated with my name.
but yah K, i like the fact that you let us shoot the breeze.
but if it wasn't for the few 'rightwingers' here you guys would just be arguing shades of liberal and thats never as fun.
i enjoy seeing xoxos's seething cynicism and intellectual arrogance....
i enjoy seeing pongoids view of the world because he is the only liberal on this board that sounds like he is talking what he believes instead of 'what a good liberal' is supposed to say...
i enjoy k talking about his son and giving a different perspective on race issues...
i enjoy wondering if influx is ever gonna get caught by the tax man for his ebay loot... (jk)
i enjoy tortoise who can, at the drop of a hat drop more facts about the *most* obscure topics known to man than you knew were possible...
i admire zazza for the fact he may be the only human being with more time on his hands than is humanly possible!
each of you guys over the years has built up little personalities in my head. we are all a bit wierd and out of the norm here but in general its always fun conversation.
personally, i would hope that we could all have a bit of comradity (sp?) because of the fact we all dig producing etc in spite of our differences.
so yah K lets keep the thoughts flowing.... and keep allowing us inferior 'rightwingers' to pollute your board or it would get boring, ya know?
jamey
Message 140/188 16-Sep-02 @ 04:19 AM - RE: september 11th
i think at the end of this year a
'most insensitive and badly timed thread'
award should be added....
sorry to upset the free-thinkers
Message 141/188 16-Sep-02 @ 04:27 AM - RE: september 11th
ahahahahha!
Message 142/188 16-Sep-02 @ 05:05 AM - RE: september 11th
the core political definition of a liberal is usually someone who desires a large government involvement, no?
I really dont think I or pongoid, or any of the other folks here you call liberals truly qualify!
Message 143/188 16-Sep-02 @ 07:44 AM - RE: september 11th
Message 145/188 16-Sep-02 @ 12:11 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 146/188 16-Sep-02 @ 02:24 PM - RE: september 11th
yes comaradarie was the word escaping my lips (call it bush disease)
to a right winger, liberitatrians are liberals too :-)
jamey
Message 147/188 16-Sep-02 @ 02:37 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 148/188 16-Sep-02 @ 02:38 PM Edit: 16-Sep-02 | 02:39 PM - RE: september 11th
the thing is, i have just watched the animation which started this whole thread. and i have to say it is an utter piece of bull, cheesy beyond belief, accompanied by a chart hit, and assembled in way that to me takes the piss out of the whole horrible event. sorry, its looks like a bloody joke. i cant believe that a presentation like this makes any one here feel patriotic!
Message 149/188 16-Sep-02 @ 03:03 PM - RE: september 11th
This line:
"stop your whinging and tantrum throwing and chucking the rattle out of the pram all the time"
gave me my first good laugh since getting laid off.
I think I'll just chuck it all and go start a music letter and live out of my car.
Thank you for your strength, and to hell with the whingers, _and_ the whinging.
One thing I've learned: the higher up on the greed chain you are, the more whingeing you do. It's amazing, but true. And the more you expect the news media to cover it and to give you a medal and put up a monument in your honor, for having done such a great job at whingeing.
Not for me. I'll go start a revolution instead.
rt
Message 151/188 16-Sep-02 @ 06:48 PM - RE: september 11th
espoo2
Posts: 505
Link?: No link
File?: No file
Simple question/solution:
Why the hell do we have to meddle with everyone's business? 9-11 wouldnt have happened had we not been f'ing with the arabs for years and years to get our slimy hands on their oil.
Message 152/188 16-Sep-02 @ 08:02 PM - RE: september 11th
the funny part was...and what set me off..is that the site is called "politics and protest"?
should be called polemics and propaganda
Message 153/188 16-Sep-02 @ 08:15 PM - RE: september 11th
i got a call today at work. "city and state please?"
"norwich house"
apparently norwich house or something.. norris.. is some building at michigan state u. now what the fuck kind of intelligent being thinks just saying "norwich house" is going to get you there from a public *411 service?
that's fucking pig ignorance, my friend. downright disgusting in a 'college level education.'
i've repeatedly mentioned the 12 year old-sounding kid who called me up.. "john's house.."
so if i say "the people are fucking pig ignorant robots with piss in their skulls" it's NOT arrogance, you got that?
do you understand? that's downright pragmatic realism. i'm just calling it what it is.
Message 154/188 16-Sep-02 @ 08:20 PM - RE: september 11th
they're fucking ding dongs, a really great proportion of them. a great, big, sad, horrific proportion.
Message 155/188 16-Sep-02 @ 08:32 PM Edit: 16-Sep-02 | 08:34 PM - RE: september 11th
pict
Posts: 1005
Link?: No link
File?: No file
Message 156/188 16-Sep-02 @ 09:45 PM - RE: september 11th
I ran across an AOL board the other day..opinions about bush and current US affairs...
benefit of the doubt OUT the window. theyre idiots. all of em
at least Im only half
Message 157/188 16-Sep-02 @ 09:55 PM - RE: september 11th
you know inbound will make you looney? its not as if you are the only one who has worked it. people were not any smarter in 1992-5. actually yes they probably were.
public education.
but thats another thread.
jamey
Message 158/188 16-Sep-02 @ 11:51 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 159/188 17-Sep-02 @ 12:20 AM - RE: september 11th
not all isms are detrimental...love of ones country is a great thing as long as it's tempered...I say
Message 160/188 17-Sep-02 @ 11:59 PM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
Posts: 1502
Link?: No link
File?: No file
Message 162/188 19-Sep-02 @ 07:03 AM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
Posts: 1502
Link?: No link
File?: No file
Wonder why Sadaam banned US oil companies from Iraq?
hmmmm...
Message 163/188 20-Sep-02 @ 06:46 PM - RE: september 11th
Ape
Message 164/188 20-Sep-02 @ 07:21 PM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
Posts: 1502
Link?: No link
File?: No file
Message 165/188 21-Sep-02 @ 01:58 AM - RE: september 11th
remember when i was rambling on about religious freedom?
when nation-states are married to religion, you get people killing people for not being the same flavor as the nation-state.
rome did it to christians
christians did it to muslims
christian catholics did it to christian protestants
christian protestants did it to christian protestants
etc etc etc over the course of like 1800 years.
now we have actually had religious freedom for a while and people loose all sense of history.
the *only* time christians kill anyone is when it is a christianity that is melded into the nation state.
right now muslims and communists are the biggest murderers of christians in the world. so don't suggest that its not happening now. it is.
and please don't suggest that my religion says that we are to kill people who are not in my religion. it says the complete opposite. you can look it up for yourself in the new testament. the koran, on the other hand is very explicit on what to do with infidels, you can look it up yourself.... hence my rantings on this thread.
if anyone was to *really* follow the teachings of christ they would become a true pacifist like the earliest christians were.... i am not there yet.
jamey
Message 166/188 21-Sep-02 @ 02:22 AM - RE: september 11th
Message 167/188 21-Sep-02 @ 10:52 AM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
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formant:'if anyone was to *really* follow the teachings of christ they would become a true pacifist like the earliest christians were.... i am not there yet. '
Indeed, the romans used to throw the christians to the lions for being pacifists and refusing to serve in the army..
Unforunately, though, a lot of christians adhere to the old testament as well as the new and that is pretty bloodthirsty...
Message 168/188 21-Sep-02 @ 11:47 AM - RE: september 11th
I like that story about Nasrudin... the one where his neighbour borrows his big cooking pot... The neighbour is a bit of a joker and decides to take the piss a bit... So when he returns the pot, he hands over Nasrudin's pot, AND another litle pot.
Nasrudin asks, "So what's with this little pot"?
"Oh" says the neighbour, "they bred over in my kitchen and according to the law, as you own the big pot which gave birth, this new little pot belongs to you!"
Nasrudin thinks.. "Ok then mr Joker"... and carries on until one day he needs to borrow his neighbours large pot in return...
After a few days the neighbour is getting upset because nasrudin has not returned his pot, so he goes round and raps on the door...
"Where's my cooking pot you borrowed nasrudin?" , he asks...
"Well" says Nasrudin, "sadly, it died!... so you can't have it back!...."
"How can a cooking pot 'die' " ??, splutters his neighbour...
"Well, we did establish the fact that the pots are mortal didnt we!?
cracks me up that one... er...
Message 169/188 21-Sep-02 @ 01:13 PM Edit: 21-Sep-02 | 01:42 PM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
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BBC News
If you want to see the blueprint for all this stuff.. read this:
RebuildingAmericasDefenses
written in 2000, commisioned by Cheney et al.
News article here
Bush planned Iraq 'regime change' before becoming President
and here's the new policy document from the whitehouse
Message 170/188 21-Sep-02 @ 01:40 PM Edit: 21-Sep-02 | 01:40 PM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
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Message 171/188 21-Sep-02 @ 02:06 PM - RE: september 11th
you, know, it really might be worth pointing out the hypoc..
no, actually, i'd probably just be wasting my breath, wouldn't i
Message 172/188 21-Sep-02 @ 02:25 PM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
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From this moment on we are all citizens of the Greater America.
Message 173/188 21-Sep-02 @ 03:59 PM - RE: september 11th
"for being pacifists and refusing to serve in the army" well depending on the emporer it was normally failing to participate in the official roman religion that got them killed. no sacrifice given to ceaser, then they were killed.
did you know that the romans called christians 'athiests' because they worshipped an invisible god that wasn't a statue you could see and touch?
jamey
Message 174/188 21-Sep-02 @ 04:28 PM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
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Message 175/188 21-Sep-02 @ 06:16 PM - RE: september 11th
come on now, tell the truth..
Message 176/188 21-Sep-02 @ 11:17 PM - RE: september 11th
i think that christianity needs neither.
but yes xoxos i definately look back to them as role models...
jamey
Message 177/188 21-Sep-02 @ 11:34 PM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
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Message 179/188 22-Sep-02 @ 01:13 PM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
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Message 182/188 22-Sep-02 @ 08:10 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 183/188 22-Sep-02 @ 09:06 PM - RE: september 11th
Message 184/188 23-Sep-02 @ 04:28 PM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
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heh
Message 186/188 24-Sep-02 @ 07:28 AM - RE: september 11th
Zazza
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Message 188/188 24-Sep-02 @ 12:25 PM - RE: september 11th
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